r/travisandtaylor • u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) • 15d ago
Unpopular Opinion: Taylor is ultimately responsible for Ana Benevides' death
I've always been downvoted to hell in other subs, but my opinion remains unchanged.
I believe Taylor is ultimately responsible for Ana Benevides' death from heat exhaustion at her Brazil show.
Yes, there is blame to share. I understand the venue didn't allow water bottles inside, etc. But the buck should always stop with the performer, and the fact that Taylor had to stop her show *multiple* times to ensure the fans passing out got water should have been a red flag to her and her team. Temperatures were above 100 degrees during the daytime. She's not stupid.
It's also bullshit how the statement put out by Taylor claimed Ana died before the concert when in reality, she died during the second song. If Taylor's team truly didn't know a fan died *during* her concert, she needs a new team because that's an entirely new level of ineptitude. (I actually believe she knew and intentionally lied about it for PR purposes.)
Additionally, Ana's family mentioned that no one from Taylor's team reached out for them for days, until ultimately public pressure forced Taylor to acknowledge them.
I've heard all of the excuses about her contract, the promoter, blah blah blah. I don't fucking care. If Taylor isn't calling the shots at her own concert, then who is? Swifties claim she IS the music industry, yet apparently isn't powerful enough to stop her own show when fans are passing out and dying? Get the fuck out of her with that bullshit. Oh, she was afraid of being sued? The billionaire who hands out millions in bonuses to her truck drivers was worried about getting sued for a few million? Again, GTFO.
When fans died at Travis Scott's concert, he was criticized for not stopping the show. Yet Taylor isn't responsible because it's always someone else's fault when it comes to her.
Here's what I think happened: Taylor didn't care that someone died. She hated Brazil so badly that she wanted to be done, so she pushed through it despite the risk to her fans. She wanted to cash that check and go home. The only reason she postponed the show was because of the bad press she was getting from Ana's death. It was actually *cooler* on the day she postponed than previous days.
Par for the course, Taylor. Par for the course.
RIP Ana. I'm sorry no one will be held accountable for your death because Taylor is untouchable. You deserved better.
Edit: Just found out an estimated 1,000 fans fainted that day. WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK? Who in their right mind would still have a concert with a 139 degree heat index?!
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u/blahblahbrandi 13d ago
I don't agree that she's like solely responsible here but there's definitely some merit to what you've said, and I do think Taylor will never return to Brazil. That bitch booked it out of there with a quickness
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u/AncientGrapefruit7 14d ago
The venue is to blame. maybe also Taylor's management team and government officials in Brazil. But I do not expect Taylor Swift to be an expert in public safety. That's what venue staff and government officials are for. if conditions were that unsafe and the venue could not safely accomodate that many people - that is something venue officials should have known and communicated.
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u/BusyBeth75 11d ago
This. I’ve been to outdoor concerts where water was provided for free and thrown into the crowd who then passed it to whoever else needed it. Granted it was a small venue but, Psy the Gangnam Style, does his concerts outside the right way. There are hoses spraying water on people to keep them cool.
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u/Emmahey712 14d ago
Ok. I read and re-read what you wrote. I just want to address a few things. The temperature that day is typical for that area. It was not an anomaly. There were cooling stations set up in and around the stadium. As hot as it was, you cannot change rules and allow outside containers or water bottles to be brought in and risk someone bringing in alcohol and that leading to a minor getting alcohol or someone over-consuming.
I think the best thing to do would have been have water at a cheaper price so people can afford to get as much as they need to stay hydrated.
However, Taylor Swift on tour is a business. She is not in charge. Her name is used in the contracts with everyone from the vendors to the garbage collectors. Had they given water for free, the vendors would have lost money and sued for breach of contract. As much as it sucks, they have to stick to what guidelines are in the contract signed many, many months before.
Just like with rain or snow, it’s very hard to predict the weather at showtime. You have a pretty good idea about the heat index several days out but it is normal for that area to have high humidity as well as high heat index.
The cooling stations in place are large fans with cool mist blowing. Most people don’t want to leave their seat for long stretches of time to go to them.
When this poor woman died, there had to be an autopsy done to determine certainty of cause of death. Taylor, nor her team, could not say anything until they knew for sure what caused her to die. As much as it appears cold and detached, it would have been impossible for them to make a statement without all of the facts. There is also responsibility that will need to be determined. Who is ultimately at fault? As hot as it was, this again is not unusual for this area. The woman had a choice to attend the concert. Did she have underlying or known health issues? Was she hydrated enough prior to the concert? Did she have the means and opportunity to go to the cooling stations and buy water? Had she had any alcohol which can cause someone to dehydrate more rapidly, leading to catastrophic results? The stadium also has a responsibility to make sure their facilities were equipped to handle that many attendees who would need access to the cooling stations and water fountains if unable to afford water.
These are all factors that have to be addressed and not just placing blame on Taylor Swift or Taylor Swift Inc. As badly as it appears that this was mishandled, you have to break down different sections of the whole scenario to understand why some things happened the way they did. Sadly, this woman died and that is tragic. I pray that this is an opportunity for everyone to make changes that will prevent a tragedy like this from happening again.
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u/Live_Ferret_4721 14d ago
I find it hilarious you think any single one individual gets to make choices like these. You’ve clearly never worked in any corporation, at least in a position that’s part of the decision chain. You probably think the president makes decisions as a sole entity too
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u/anyasrose 14d ago
I wouldn't say she is responsible but I hated the way she and her team handled it. The worst part was seeing fans raising money to get Ana's body back home (as she lived in another state). The bare minimum Taylor could've done was help Ana's family say their goodbyes but in the end, her own fans had to take action. Not to mention the articles her team put out about her relationship with Travis and claiming she had reached out to Ana's family, when her own cousin went on Twitter and said it wasn't true. After this whole mess, I just could not see Taylor the same way.
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u/Yadons 14d ago
First, she did not die at the concert. She died at the hospital. Many people were transported there for fainting. She died an hour after arriving to the hospital which was probably at least 2 hours into the show. How would her team know that? They notify the family not Tree Paine. Then the hospital has to notify family and deal with the tragedy of it with the family. It was a tragic accident.
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u/2_Cute_Caboo 14d ago
Wait something like this happened? I had no idea! What the fuck?! Granted I have long since stopped paying attention to celebrity shit because it’s a goddamn rabbit hole that sucks you in and won’t let you out but shit man! Why the fuck didn’t she stop the concert?! If over 1,000 people fainted or something from heat stroke during your concert I would think you would want to I don’t know maybe not perform there?! And this is coming from someone who has suffered heat stroke before and believe me it is not fun at all! To die from something like that is an awful way to go!
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u/Huge-Error-4916 14d ago
On the one hand, you berate her for not postponing the Rio show because of the heat and events that occurred there when she had little to no prior knowledge, but then you turn around and berate her again for postponing a show for the same risks that you complained about the first time because she should've done it the first time around? Like she can't learn a lesson and try to do better next time? I seriously hope no one in your life treats you with this kind of impossible standard.
This was unprecedented heat in Rio. In the summer, the highs are usually in the 80s, not over 100. Just look up average summer climate in Rio De Janeiro. There's no way they could have predicted this before scheduling of the concert took place, probably years prior. Many places in Brazil don't have air conditioners at all because the temps are usually on the milder side.
It is highly unlikely that anyone on Taylor's team new about the death immediately when it happened, so an immediate reaction is unreasonable to expect.
She did what she could do at the time - getting water for the fans that needed it.
I grew up in a time where if an artist cancelled a show, they were dragged for being selfish and not considering all the fans that paid, made travel arrangements, took off work, etc to get there, so it was seen as disrespectful to cancel a show. Now, we say they're selfish and money hungry for continuing the show. Damned if you do, damned if you don't, I guess.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Heat index at 138 and she still went on.
Dumb. Just dumb.
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u/StonedGamerGirl89 14d ago
So is she supposed to provide water for everyone at all her concerts? No she isn't. Is she supposed to contact every fans family after they die...NO thats weird af the girl chose to go to a concert in BRAZIL IN THE MIDDLE OF SUMMER it's hot. Play stupid games win stupid prizes. It's not Taylor's fault the girl died just like it's not the dealers fault when an addict dies they have a choice not to use she had an option not to go or to leave if she wasn't feeling well or was uncomfortable.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
No, she’s supposed to care about the safety of her fans by not having a concert with a heat index of 138 degrees. Is that too much to ask?
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u/StonedGamerGirl89 14d ago
When she's signs a contract she is held liable for not being there or being late. So no she shouldn't have refused to preform knowing it could cost her. How about the geniuses that knew it was a heat index of 138⁰ and weren't going to have giant fans on them like the performer was STAY HOME. The people who showed up seen the same weather reports it's their own fault for choosing to show up still. Maybe have more sense and care about yourself more than you care about seeing a Taylor swift concert.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
So you acknowledge Taylor puts profits before fan safety. Glad we’re on the same page.
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u/StonedGamerGirl89 14d ago
Yes, and so does Travis Scott and all other artists. No one is putting a gun to people's heads and making them go to these concerts it's a choice. She made a choice, not a great one but a choice none the less. Accidents happen, but ultimately, it's the girls' fault for not leaving or staying home in the first place. Personally I wouldn't have gone with a 100+ heat index. The girl chose and chose wrong. It sucks it happened but it's no one's fault but her own.
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u/spookypups 14d ago
the fact i didn’t even hear about this happening anywhere until now is wild. i don’t understand how they wouldn’t know if someone died during the show like they have radios and stuff right??? if you know there is a risk for anything like that and you aren’t decent enough to cancel you should at least have a system set up to be able to communicate in the event anything bad were to happen. unbelievable.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Right. 1,000 fans fainted that day. There’s no WAY Taylor didn’t know.
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u/RowSubstantial7143 14d ago
Did anyone notice how annoyed she was when she had to stop the show and ask for someone to give a fan water? People are like “she’s so kind and caring!”
There should have been no performance in those conditions, It should have been rescheduled.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Just found out 1,000 fans fainted that day. What the actual fuck
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u/GodDammitKevinB 14d ago
And almost all of them sat outside for hours ahead of time to get better seating. Ana died during the second song because of her time spent outside waiting. That’s on her.
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u/bev665 14d ago
Nope. As someone who's worked in production, the buck does not stop with Taylor. This is the venue's fault.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Why shouldn’t it stop with her? She’s not in charge of the decisions made at the concert?
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u/LadyEncredible 14d ago
Yes and no (and let me say, I can't STAND Taylor swift OR her fans, I know a Swiftie in real life and she is the most vapid, self centered, spoiled, grown ass brat and from what I've seen and heard, that's how the majority of Taylor Swift fans are and they suck, not all, but a HUGE majority). But the artist is only in charge of THEIR stuff, like the band, their musicians, their equipment, their set list, the staging (to some extent), etc. The venue is the one responsible for having vendors that sell water or setting the rules of the venue (the artist can ban cell phones and things of that nature).
HOWEVER, with all of that said, I do agree that Taylor and her team would've known the venue rules and Taylor could've either provided water, changed up her show do there was an intermission and people could go get water, refused to play because the venue was creating an unsafe environment for her fans, etc.
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u/AlternativeWall-9282 14d ago
I’m not one to defend Taylor but I don’t think it’s fair to blame her when there were a lot of other factors that day that lead to Ana’s passing. I’m more pissed that she just pretends like it didn’t happen.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
I literally said there’s blame to share. Why shouldn’t Taylor take responsibility for things that happen at her own concert? It’s just like Trump. Always blame someone else for the bad things. Take credit for the good things.
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u/Antique-Buffalo-5475 14d ago
Not sure I agree with your overall take but respect it. However, to compare to Travis Scott is a little disingenuous. Travis was tweeting before the concert for people to storm the gates and essentially created and egged on the conditions. He helped create the mass mania. Taylor wasn’t telling anyone to do anything like that.
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u/sashie_belle 14d ago
I understand venues need to make money but seems like they should monitor weather conditions and allow it. I can't imagine it being THAT hot and being in a huge crowd to boot.
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u/Helpful_Honeydew_284 14d ago
I thought about this a lot too, poor girl. I think this is exactly why there are “cult” vibes for this fandom. People risk their jobs for Taylor, they go into debt to see her, they risk their own lives for her. And I’m happy I found this sub bc while I have enjoyed some of her music, it’s nice to see that there are people out there who can maintain critical thinking skills.
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u/Fair-Butterfly9989 14d ago
I agree with everything but your last paragraph about her not caring. I think the situation really affected her.
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u/Prior-Throat-8017 14d ago
What upsets me most is the fact that she refused to acknowledge it. A Coldplay fan died right before the concert due to previous health complications (it had nothing to do with them) and they dedicated a song to her. A fan dies literally due to one of Taylor’s concerts and she’s like “omg guys if I talk about her I’ll cry” yeah that’s the fucking point. Use your platform to call this BS out.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Yep. Then to not even get the basic facts right before releasing a statement was a choice
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u/likeabadhabit 14d ago
“It is with a shattered heart I say we lost a fan earlier tonight before my show”
That wording was very deliberate, nasty work on Taylor’s part. She did literally everything possible to distance herself from the death from saying the fan was lost, not that she tragically died, to emphasizing multiple times that it wasn’t during her show when it 100% was and she absolutely knew that for a fact. Anyone who says otherwise is delusional. This doesn’t even take into account that it was wholly her event. It doesn’t matter if it was before it started, during the opener or smack dab in the middle of her set. It was her show, period. The whole thing is revolting.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Yep. And you’re telling me she didn’t notice the commotion? I think Ana even had floor tickets? Could be wrong about that.
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u/Own_Faithlessness769 14d ago
You think that a performer with hundreds of lights in their eyes, trying to sing and dance, would be able to take in everything happened in a massive crowd and spot an issue? It's just not going to happen. I imagine most of the time she can see a few rows in front of her when she focuses, and everything else is just a blur.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
So she can read signs in the top row but can’t see when a fan dies? Always an excuse.
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
Ana was not pronounced dead until she was transported to the hospital after multiple resuscitation attempts. Stop trying to imply that Ana’s body was just hanging out. You clearly haven’t read enough into it. Ana sought out medical attention from emergency responders who were present at the event when she started to feel unwell. She did collapse at the event, but she likely would have been concealed from others in a medical tent where Taylor would not have been able to see. You are simply uninformed. There’s a whole ass Wikipedia page.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Just read the Wiki. 1,000 FANS FAINTED. WHAT THE FUCK?!? And you think Taylor bears NO responsibility? WHAAAAAT?
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Ana_Clara_Benevides
Wikipedia has a ton of linked sources, too…
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
1,000 fans fainted. And she still performed.
Jesus christ this is worse than I originally imagined
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
I never said she doesn’t bear responsibility. You are not being objective about the situation and it shows.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
I literally said in my post there is blame to share. But the call to stop the show was ultimately her responsibility, unless you’re alleging Taylor is some puppet controlled by a shadowy organization?
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
You have also said “I could be wrong about” such and such. You clearly haven’t looked into this situation enough and it shows. There is no point engaging with you anymore until you gather all the facts, as you are blatantly and obviously basing your opinion on assumption and what you think you know, but aren’t quite too sure about. You don’t know that the call to stop the show was her responsibility given the sheer amount of people involved in/responsible for the production of the show. By all means though, die on this hill if you really want to.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
“Die on this hill if you really want to”. Maybe if I attend a Taylor concert, I will. 🙃
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u/QueenBoleyn 14d ago
and you can see Taylor clearly struggling to breathe while she's performing so there's zero excuse for her to not stop the show. You'd think she'd have some common sense and realize that if she can't breathe on stage then it must be much worse in the crowd.
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u/Own_Faithlessness769 14d ago
What do you think someone dying looks like? It doesn't come with fireworks or something, its just a poor girl slumping to the floor. Theres a massive difference between that and a signs thats designed to be read at a distance.
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u/likeabadhabit 14d ago
Taylor was playing a stadium which is obviously huge, but there have been other artists to play stadiums that notice fans are struggling and stop the show or call security. She was able to see and hear people asking for water just fine and those folks weren’t even just in the first few rows on the floor, they stretched further back. I’m sure she didn’t see Ana actually losing her life, especially since she was doing cruel summer which is one of the songs that take her all over the stage, but it’s very implausible that there wasn’t major commotion when someone was literally dying and paramedics had to enter.
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u/Own_Faithlessness769 14d ago
Stadium security go out of their way to make sure there isn’t major commotion since it doesn’t help anyone.
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u/FancySchmancy4 14d ago
Taylor never responds to things she’s involved in until well after public backlash
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u/anonymousdagny 15d ago
Hey 👋🏻 this sub keeps getting suggested to me I’m assuming cause I interact with Taylor Swift subs. I’m a fan personally but I know not everyone is and that’s cool.
I don’t know Taylor IRL so I’m not assuming xyz for reasoning, but I do think this is a strange take.
No, no one should die at a concert esp under the conditions Ana did - rest in peace.
Blaming the artist in this situation is confusing to me. Plus we dk the full truth of what went on after and what private communication may have occurred so idk how we can honestly analyze that aspect of the situation with any accuracy.
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u/Fearless_Smoke6651 15d ago
i was there on twitter when this happened, ana’s family had to ask for help with money to get ana’s body home and brazil twitter swifties are the ones who made enough for her family to get her back and have a funeral, with no word from taylor. taylor didn’t even say her name, help the family, nothing. it’s truly disgusting and it’s when i started to dislike her
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u/Right-Warning3346 14d ago
Taylor publicy mentioned her at the next concert she performed (Sunday, after she canceled Saturday due to the death) and on social media. I believe she dedicated a song to her? I was at the concert on night 1 when Ana died and none of us had any idea until the next morning that someone had died
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u/AdIntelligent6557 15d ago
If you’re being downvoted for disagreeing with OP I’m giving your points back. I can only do 1 point.
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u/rachel_soup 15d ago
Ehhh I’m not a Swiftie by any means, but this is a reach. I traveled with Warped Tour for about 5 summers in a row with either bands or Alt Press and there were PLENTY of incidents of heat stroke and people being transported by ambulance, etc. We would still be out there all day, bands playing, inciting mosh pits and death walls. I’ve seen kids get their literal faces broken in mosh pits and leave with cops and ambulances. I’ve never heard someone blame any of those bands for things happening on tours.
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u/GroinFlutter 15d ago
Yeah, medical emergencies at concerts and festivals are nothing new. if performers actually stopped for every single incident, they couldn’t get through a set.
If you or your friend aren’t feeling well, you take them to the med tent. If you feel like you need some water, you leave the crowd and you get some.
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u/rachel_soup 15d ago edited 14d ago
I mean there’s ZERO way Warped would’ve been allowed to continue every year if that were the case, lol. I lugged around 50lbs of camera equipment in 120 degree heat and we all knew our limits.
Maybe it’s just me - but I grew up the same way you look out for your friends and get them water or to the med tent if you need - not that every artist was responsible for every attendees well being.
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u/Famous_Fruit5722 15d ago
Should Billie Eillish be responsible for the 2 people that died at Coachella to see her years back from dehydration and stroke? Wild take
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u/Emotional_Finish_963 14d ago
Tbh, no. Coachella in my opinion is different from your average concert. Coachella has plenty of food & drink vendors available that they could have accessed.
The venue Taylor was using doesn’t allow people the access to water. It’s not really Taylor’s fault that someone unfortunately passed away but it’s 100% her fault with the after math. How it was handled etc.
Again, it’s sad that anyone passes away at concerts/shows but comparing Coachella events to Concert events isn’t okay. They’re not even comparable considering they’re all on different levels.
At this point I don’t think venues that don’t allow at least water to the people in attendance should ever be booked. Make them change their rules
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u/QueenBoleyn 14d ago
How is that similar? The heat in California is completely different than South America and the venues were completely different. Also, Billie was only performing at Coachella while this is Taylor's tour and under her control. You can't compare the two.
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u/basicalme 15d ago
This is a good analogy. And the hospitals in the desert are absolutely flooded during Coachella too. Pulling off international shows involves so many logistics professionals, insurance companies etc. I don’t think people realize how removed Taylor would be from what’s happening on the ground and the decision making. And how could she be, there would be entire companies with employees managing the details in pulling off an international tour. And this is why so many performers don’t go beyond NA and Europe. Layers upon layers doing business internationally.
If I’m going to place blame on anyone it would be her liability insurer. Although I am assuming the venue had to provide and show proof of liability and compliance for the venue safety. So when people mention people on her “team” checking this it’s more like whichever company/law firm/insurance company employee didn’t do their homework to see that this venue had some previous issues with improper ventilation.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
It’s a dumb analogy. One is a festival, the other is a concert. Two very different things, especially when it comes to calling the shots.
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u/Right-Warning3346 14d ago
So I was actually there on night one in Rio. The Record breaking heat was insane and hotter than Brazil had ever seen, though they are very used to higher temperatures and humidity. The venue is massive, the standing space is crowded and chaotic, we didn’t even know that someone had died until the next day. But the heat was some of the most oppressive I’ve ever felt in my life, we were soaked through our clothes with sweat and just kind of breathed through it. My printed out tickrt disintegrated in my hands from my body being so hot. I don’t know how Taylor could have suddenly canceled and safely had everyone exit such a massive chaotic stadium safely, we were deep in the favelas and it was already extremely overwhelming and chaotic.
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u/Right-Warning3346 14d ago
I don’t think anyone fully realized what packing that open aired stadium in record breaking heat would result in. It was an otherworldly experience, part incredible part survival and a lot of adrenaline
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u/South-Style-134 15d ago
I think there’s a certain level of maturity required to call off a show like that, and if what has been asserted in other posts on this sub is true, Taylor is stuck in high school. Would a high schooler have the wherewithal to just stop a show? I know she’s a grown woman, but does she have the maturity to act like one?
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u/pm174 14d ago
The venue closed the vents, Taylor didn't have a say in that if I remember correctly
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
You all act like Taylor was forced to perform. You’re telling me she couldn’t have said “open the vents or I don’t perform”? Come on
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u/brandyandburbon 15d ago
Partly. The vents were closed by the concert promoter, not Taylor and her team. The promoter didn’t want anyone outside the venue to hear/see the concert. At the time locals were posting about that being a regular occurrence with this particular concert promoter.
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u/mattchinn 15d ago
Blaming an artist for the death of a fan who didn’t hydrate properly is an absurd thing to say. lol
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u/MileHighSugar 15d ago
The difference in scrutiny received by Travis Scott and Taylor Swift for deaths of fans at their concerts is stark. While many more died at Travis Scott’s concerts and he also fostered a very aggressive atmosphere in his fan base, both had control over the circumstances which ultimately led to the deaths of their fans and instead chose profit over humanity.
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u/South-Style-134 15d ago
Travis is definitely more at fault for his incident especially given his pattern of acting out and getting the crowd too riled up. Taylor’s responsibility is more of a negligence thing partly from poor planning.
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u/MileHighSugar 15d ago edited 14d ago
I absolutely feel Travis Scott’s situation had many factors that he deserved scrutiny for: 1. Repeatedly goaded* his fans to be aggressive with security and cross boundaries when it came to safety 2. The design of the actual festival layout trapped his fans and thus the aggressive nature of his fan base created an even more dangerous situation that resulted in more deaths
HOWEVER, both Taylor and Travis were given information before and during their shows which provided them the opportunity to stop their shows and save lives. They both chose not to. Taylor did NOT get the same public scrutiny for similar choices, period.
And what’s even more strange is what both of them did AFTER those deaths.
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u/kylecxo 14d ago
Goated vs goaded here is killing me
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u/MileHighSugar 14d ago edited 14d ago
I had at least 3 margaritas last night after a hard week, gimme a break 🥲
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u/South-Style-134 15d ago
She definitely should have gotten more scrutiny for the weird photo op with the family. So weird.
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u/MileHighSugar 15d ago
Totally. I don’t understand what the aim was of that photo? Because showing empathy or remorse certainly wasn’t what came across.
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u/GoldEscape7018 15d ago
Supposedly there was legal issues if she did cancel and someone said she could have faced jail time. Not sure if that is true. Supposedly the country and venue was not going to let that happen. This is a foreign country who at times is not completely ethical. I do believe didn’t want to perform in that and she did struggle, nor her dancers.
However, I don’t think she was choked up about as she said she was. I think she legally couldn’t talk about it , so made a post . Fans made it out like she lost someone and she didn’t.
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u/South-Style-134 15d ago
If those potential consequences were true, wouldn’t Taylor’s team have cited them in her statement? Also, surely Taylor isn’t the only performer that would have had those conditions imposed so I think it’s more likely another performer would have spoken out about crap policy.
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u/no1howdareyou 15d ago
What?? Don't believe everything you read. She absolutely wouldn't have faced jail time -- what the fuck? Do you think concerts don't get postponed in Brazil ever? And no there was nothing stopping her legally from speaking up. There is no such thing as condolences being an "admission of guilt" as some swifties tried to pull.
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u/no1howdareyou 15d ago
It definitely wasn't cooler on the day she postponed. It was really really hot since early morning and it was supposed to be the hottest day of the year. That weekend was pretty hot but the day she postponed was even hotter than the day before. It only got cooler on Sunday when the concert happened -- source: was there lol
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u/kbdouluvvme 15d ago
This is such a huge reach. If someone got punched so hard at a baseball game during a crowd fight and fell down the stairs and died, would we be blaming a baseball player?
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u/Prestigious-A-154 15d ago
Baseball players have no control over people fighting in the stands. The part Taylor had control in was doing something to ensure fans were going to be well hydrated and okay. I'd be concerned for my fans if I knew they were all going to be crowded in a stadium with no ventilation.
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u/kbdouluvvme 15d ago
When has a musician ever stopped and said “you know what I should do right now, go give my fans some water”
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u/QueenBoleyn 14d ago
I saw Fall out Boy last year and they stopped the show to give fans water. It happens pretty often so...
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
And Taylor actually did do this during the performance. OP is uninformed and shouldn’t have created this post without all the facts.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Here’s a youtube video of bands stopping concerts to check on fans. It’s not unusual at all, unless you’re Taylor. https://youtu.be/BXaGp2SIbeY?si=Zp78HF5HlQkGxVL2
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u/loneviolet 14d ago
And here's a video of Taylor doing the same thing in brazil. https://www.tiktok.com/@mobertha/video/7302636888744086826. There are also videos of her throwing water into the crowd herself. None of her demeanor seems like annoyance for having to stop, she seems worried and stressed.
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u/Prestigious-A-154 15d ago
I did not say that. I am saying she could have discussed about it with her team and shared her concerns, but it's clear she had none.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 15d ago
Well that’s a dumb analogy. How about if there’s a lightening storm and the teams don’t halt the game and someone gets struck and dies. They aren’t partially responsible?
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u/bmcthomas 14d ago
No they aren’t.
Players do not decide when to call a game for weather. The grounds crew and umpires do. The venue will ask fans to move out of open stands in cases of lightning. No player is personally responsible for ensuring that individual fans follow that instruction.
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
The umpires have the final say, but teams can DEFINITELY advocate for a rain delay. To say otherwise is nonsense.
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u/bmcthomas 14d ago
So under your logic, if I’m at a game and choose to stay in the stands during a storm, and get struck by lightning, I can sue all 18 players on the field individually because they are each personally responsible for ensuring that I am not injured?
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 14d ago
Why are you comparing a concert of one singer to a baseball game? Totally different events. Are you saying Taylor doesn’t call the shots at her own concert?
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u/kbdouluvvme 15d ago
Dude, Taylor and her team aren’t responsible for how well or not someone hydrated and maintains their health. Is it tragic she passed? Absolutely. Is Taylor “ultimately” responsible? Absolutely not. There’s a reason you’ve been downvoted in other subs and are being downvoted now.
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u/Right-Warning3346 14d ago
They actually took our water bottles away at the entrance and wouldn’t let us bring them in. A guy pushed through selling water on the ground and my friend and I both bought one, it was very chaotic on the floor. An hour later some lady pushed through and handed us free mini waters too. It was so hot that while it felt like it barely made a difference, we were sweating SO much, I’m sure it helped us make it through the show
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u/Usual-Rich-180 15d ago
Yeah fr. You can’t blame a singer for the choices of a grown ass woman. She could have left the concert at any point. Taylor wasn’t forcing her to be there
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u/Ambitious_Wing_7027 15d ago
The wildest part to me was having Ana’s family come to a concert the next week and posing happily for a photo with them. I work in PR/crisis comms and I don’t think that was really a great move.
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u/MrMKUltra 15d ago
For Americans, yes. I bet Brazilian fans ate that up. That’s just how LatAm works tbh
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u/MileHighSugar 15d ago edited 15d ago
It’s moves like this that really show Tree isn’t a “PR GENIUS”
If she actually had the sway with Taylor and/or the PR smarts the Swifties think she has, this shit wouldn’t ever happen.
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u/freedomaintnothing 14d ago
Since hiring Tree in 2014, Taylor has repeatedly had the biggest back to back scandals of her career - not including the death of a fan at her Brazil show.
Before hiring Tree, Taylor’s biggest scandal was dating Harry Styles. That was it.
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u/Ordinary-South7133 13d ago
What about being homophobic on her first album?
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u/freedomaintnothing 13d ago
It wasn’t anything remotely close to a scandal.
Taylor just changed the lyric, made the new version a single, and radio loved it.
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u/Ambitious_Wing_7027 15d ago
She is absolutely not a “PR GENIUS” hahaha if I were Taylor I would have replaced her a long time ago
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u/Global_Telephone_751 15d ago
It felt so gross to me. Like why would they be smiling next to the superstar whose family member died to see? Like Taylor that is TERRIBLE optics. I’m shocked people bought into it, it felt soooo slimy to me. On Taylor’s end, not her family’s.
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u/Ambitious_Wing_7027 15d ago
100% agree- slimy to invite them to see the concert their family member lost her life trying to see and didn’t even get to experience fully before passing away. Seems like rubbing salt in the wound and a really easy way for Taylor to acknowledge the whole situation without having to really lift a finger. Icky for sure
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u/anyasrose 14d ago
Not to mention she couldn't even bother to mention Ana's name or at least acknowledge her family. And swifties kept making excuses saying she didn't do it for "legal reasons" 🙄
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u/MindForeverWandering 15d ago
I think she bears responsibility for poor planning, and for the way she responded to the incident. But I disagree that her stopping the show to ensure crowds got water indicates a culpability in a death that occurred before they knew that water was needed. (I suspect that they did all they could once they realized the gravity of the situation.)
I remember, fifty-five years ago, The Rolling Stones were blasted for continuing their concert at Altamont after someone in the crowd had been murdered. Afterwards, an examination of the footage from the film being made of their tour showed that they couldn’t see the incident from the stage, and would have had no way to know what happened until later.
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u/South-Style-134 15d ago
Even if they couldn’t see from the stage, I don’t know what The Rolling Stones expected when they hired Hell’s Angels to do security. Even The Grateful Dead noped right out of that one.
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u/Sailor_Marzipan 14d ago
Worth noting that the grateful dead were one of the ones who recommended using them as security. They noped out bc the venue was becoming increasingly violent.
I do think there's culpability but it's also one of those cases where hindsight is 20/20... security just wasn't standard back then the way it was today and it was going to take bad things happening for change to happen. The govt didn't require pools to be behind locked gates until kids drowned kind of thing.
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u/lemondropcloth 15d ago
in both cases (taylor and the stones) the artists were not from the country they were performing in
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u/MadameNo9 15d ago
She had a better time in São Paulo imo, I do agree with you she seemed very eager to leave Brazil once all the shows were done but I definitely think the intensity with the heat made it hard for her to enjoy performing…her crew was struggling during the whole set in Rio too, the venue should have prepared for the heat better
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u/Cultural-Treacle-680 15d ago
As if she and those planning didn’t know Brazil will be hot af sometimes. Those beaches aren’t popular for no reason. She’s probably so taken care of that she didn’t think about the fans.
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u/MadameNo9 15d ago
Wasn’t this heat wave last year a record breaking one for the area? The news reports from those days sounded like the heat was unexpectedly hotter than usual and the media was telling the general public to be very cautious being outside…I’m pretty sure they were considering cancelling N2 in Rio because of Ana’s death and the heat…I saw videos of crew throwing whatever water bottles they had, the venue sincerely should have allowed water as well
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u/no1howdareyou 15d ago
It was record breaking, yes. Of course there was a lot of bad planning/pushing through involved but it was an atypical day. And São Paulo was a lot cooler than Rio, like A LOT. It was actually kind of chilly on N1.
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u/MadameNo9 15d ago
She seemed like she had a good time in SP for sure! Got to enjoy Brazil’s energy without that heat wave stifling everyone
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u/no1howdareyou 15d ago
I hope she did because I sure did! lol I had the time of my life in Rio N2/N3? (Sunday) too despite being super anxious about it all going wrong. It was cooler and even rained so it all worked out in the end, even though there was a lot of sadness in the air after Ana's death.
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u/Fun_Shell1708 15d ago
It’s the venue. There was similar issues at Harry’s show in Brazil the year before. The venue should not be booking shows when they’re under extreme heat like that.
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u/MindForeverWandering 15d ago
If that venue had a track record of not being able to provide a safe environment in extreme heat, her team shouldn’t have considered them as a venue.
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u/Fun_Shell1708 15d ago
Taylor doesn’t live in Brazil, so she probably doesn’t know the ins and outs of the venues. Yes everyone should do their due diligence, but Brazil should have also come forward and said that in summer they have extreme heat and she should be doing the show later in the year.
Everyone has a hand in this, it doesn’t lay solely at Taylor and her teams feet.
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u/jessi1021 15d ago
I don't live in Brazil, but if I were planning a massive event outdoors (or series of events), I'd check what the weather would be like. Or have someone on my team do it. If not for the crowds, for myself.
At the end of the day she is the one on stage performing, so she is the determining factor in whether the show does go on. Yes, there are a lot of failures leading up to the point, but she could pull the plug on it. I'm guessing the concern of rescheduling/lawsuits were top of mind, so the show went on.
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u/Fun_Shell1708 15d ago
Everyone involved is at fault. Laying the blame solely at one persons feet is a bit ignorant.
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u/triflin-assHoe 14d ago
Are you going to keep responding with the same thing? We get it, you don’t think the blame should be at one persons feet, or doorstep.
However, I don’t live in Brazil, and I know they have extreme heat in the summer…
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u/Fun_Shell1708 14d ago
Yep I am. Because people keep responding the same thing 🤷🏼♀️ don’t like it? Don’t respond 😂
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u/Cultural-Treacle-680 15d ago
Everyone fucked up. Don’t put that on the true swifties sub though 🤣
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u/Fun_Shell1708 15d ago
Yeah I don’t think the blame lays solely at one doorstep. Everyone could have done better
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u/SnappinTurluh (I’m from Ohio you fucking morons) 15d ago
No one is saying she’s solely to blame. I even said there is blame to share. But ultimately, the buck should stop with her.
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15d ago
I don’t think she ever should have agreed to perform somewhere where concert goers couldn’t even have water. I don’t think she’s fully responsible, but I think she was definitely negligent and that accounts for something.
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u/Turbulent-Coast-2303 14d ago
Most venues, at least in the two US states I’ve lived in, don’t allow outside food or water.
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago
Yes, and that is hardly Taylor’s fault. This is standard procedure. My SO works security, albeit, a much smaller venue than a stadium, but is constantly having to tell patrons they cannot bring outside food or beverages. It is regulated by law in certain industries/places.
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u/Turbulent-Coast-2303 14d ago
I never said it was her fault lol. I was pointing out that rule is pretty standard in a lot of places.
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u/cwswan 14d ago
At the outdoor venues in Texas I regularly go to, they’re always giving out free water and you’re allowed to bring in your own. Many times there’s been water coolers with free refills too. These are huge pavilions too, not smaller venues. In the summer it’s regularly 100+ degrees here.
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u/Turbulent-Coast-2303 14d ago
Damn, wish Florida was on that shit. Some of the literal races I’ve ran down here in 90+ degree weather didn’t have water stations. I’ve been to some smaller local venues that allow me to bring my water bottle, but generally speaking it’s a no no and you gotta buy the $6 waters.
Though tbh I think some of the water bottle rules are specifically in place because so many people sneak vodka and shit into shows.
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u/rnason 14d ago
Most venues don't have 100+ temps
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u/Turbulent-Coast-2303 14d ago
I mean I think the venues are shitty for not allowing that… but I grew up in Florida and was in marching band at a huge university. My sister got a heat stroke at one of our shows. Multiple students passed out at band camp over the years so like… it definitely is that hot and major venues that aren’t a public university still didn’t allow for outside beverages. I’m not defending Taylor, the clear PR actions after were shitty. But the issue itself about venue safety is bigger than just her.
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14d ago
Yeah but I’m pretty sure this venue wasn’t allowing any water, like you couldn’t buy it at the venue either.
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u/Adventurous_Essay763 14d ago
That is not the case. You could buy water, you just couldn't bring it.
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u/trippapotamus 14d ago
In Vegas they had tons of water stations but that’s obviously is a whole different country. Did they not do that in Brazil? That feels wild to me given the heat.
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14d ago
How do people know this? I read an article that said water wasn’t available at the venue when this first happened.
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u/Turbulent-Coast-2303 14d ago
Now THAT is wild and fucked up if the venue wasn’t even selling water. (I mean it’s still shitty to force people to buy $6 water bottles but at least you can not die)
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u/SevereExamination810 14d ago edited 13d ago
I’m not saying it’s morally right that the prices of food and beverages at events like this are exhorbitant, but planning for events like this is very important. Ensuring you have enough money to pay for the overpriced shit they are going be selling you is paramount, especially when attending an event in such extreme temps. If you have money for the overpriced tickets, you should have money for the water/food you will likely want to or need to purchase while at the event, or you simply don’t go. I don’t think Ana is responsible at all for her own death though.
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u/Remoterdally 15d ago
This isn’t necessarily about Taylor, but you always hear how celebs get eat access to drugs because people don’t want to say no to them. That’s while often when a celeb dies of an overdose they always find that it’s usually prescription meds, not that that alone is an issue, but usually the doctor will prescribe and act in way they wouldn’t towards a normal patient.. prescribing excessive amounts of high mg meds, Prescribing meds that are dangerous in combination etc. and I’ve always felt this extends to other areas sometimes putting the celeb in risk (would Kobe’s pilot have waited for the fog to clear if it was a different customer? Would Aaliyah’s pilot not have allowed everyone’s baggage?). That would make me nervous as a celeb, if I was Taylor I would be curious if they allowed the show to continue because they thought I would have a problem if they didn’t, and they didn’t want to be the one to say no to me or were pressured by people on my team.
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u/lolololol2233 15d ago
I agree that if conditions were so bad, she should’ve taken initiative and stopped things.
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u/Imaginaryami 15d ago
I think also some people… mainly obsessives that love her or people that hate her blindly give her WAY too much credit. I think her “business” is a lot like her “songwriting” and outsourced to someone not capable of the job and then dumbly credited to her. She’s a child star she didn’t get there on her own moxie. This is one of those things where a team failed. No way she knew those little details. She’s an ARTIST. I doubt she was looking into water prices while at the superbowl. Will she now? No. Maybe her publicist will. I wouldn’t blame her though to be honestly fair I don’t think she’s a genius mastermind of ANYTHING.
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u/QueenMar_ 15d ago
They had access to water. They chose not to get it
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u/UseElectronic1780 14d ago
They had access to water but the venue closed vents and access to stadium because of fans outside. Kinda not Taylor’s fault
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u/Valuable-Pen-6061 15d ago
People insist that that water was too expensive and yeah it was expensive. But so is Taylor's concert. If it's that hot buy some water. People were getting burns from the heat, going to the medical tent, and then going BACK to their seats to get burned again. That's cult level behavior.
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u/kpiece 14d ago
And if people are doing stuff as a result of blindly submitting to a cult, then that puts responsibility on the CULT LEADER (TAYLOR) to keep her followers safe. I agree with OP’s post that Taylor is ultimately responsible here. The temperature was insanely high where it was unsafe just to be in that heat.—Taylor certainly knew about that. She should’ve postponed the show. Anyone would know that huge crowds being in that heat for a prolonged time would cause dangerous, bad effects. Everyone running the show catered to TAYLOR. She was the TOP person. The buck stopped with Taylor. She was responsible for keeping the show going, keeping her fans in that heat, and she has blood on her hands.
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u/ottersnrocks 15d ago
As someone who has been to music festivals in Texas summers, it's important to have water stations. 60,000 people all need water (in a record heatwave no less) and the best way to do that is to sell it? No, you set up multiple water stations and let people bring their own empty bottles to fill. Or hand bottles at security as they come in.
Not necessarily totally blaming Taylor Swift, but her team should have been more aware of the venue before partnering with them.
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u/mattchinn 15d ago
This. They had water. Don’t know why you’re being downvoted? lol
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u/cgriff95 Recovering Swiftie 15d ago
the water that was available was super expensive apparently
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u/PLANTGlRL 15d ago
that’s normal for every concert i’ve been to
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u/cgriff95 Recovering Swiftie 15d ago
doesn't mean it was easy for everyone to obtain. things are also run different there so it's not just like an american venue.
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u/Historical_Stuff1643 15d ago
I think the issue stemed from what happened in Nashville. There was a downpour and the stadium was flooded. People were having issues being stuck all crammed together and they didn't decide to postpone it for a bit. She got so much undo praise for her work ethic, still performing in the rain that it went to her head and she actually started to believe it was what people wanted and it was evidence of how great she was. Next time it came up, of course she didn't cancel. She could have demanded it be rescheduled. She's Taylor and treated like a God. They would've bent over backwards and she would've been haled as a hero. And give me a break - no, there wasn't going to be a stampede if she stopped the concert. . I've had similar things happen and people just get quiet and wonder what's happening. She knew how bad it is. She no doubt was out in it. She didn't have to wait for legal advice, she didn't do anything because she didn't want this attached to her at all.
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u/AffectionateJury3723 14d ago
Lots of artists have cancelled or stopped concerts early due to weather. It just seems she was irresponsible and unnecessarily put people at risk due to her ego.
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u/ultaemp 15d ago
I don’t understand the mindset of praising her for her “work ethic” for choosing to perform through inclement weather over postponing for the safety/overall better experience of the concert goers/team/venue/ect.
A little bit of rain is one thing, but severe weather is a whole other story and it’s irresponsible to put that many people at risk. I’ve attended dozens of concerts and it’s pretty common practice for shows to be postponed due to inclement weather, likely because the venue doesn’t want the liability if someone was injured/killed as a result. I agree that Taylor and her team should have been held more accountable for this tragedy. They’re not 100% at fault, but they absolutely knew of the conditions that day and ultimately still chose to go through with it regardless.
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u/swimkaz 14d ago edited 14d ago
Yeah I feel like she shoulda postponed that rain show/shows last year. It was pouring rain and concertgoers were actually miserable while watching. Her not postponing/canceling shows for her fans safety/comfort shouldn’t be praised, even if she herself can push through it.
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u/30yograndma 14d ago
I was at gillette N2 and the rain ruined the whole experience for me. By the end I was so overstimulated, exhausted, and freezing that I barely made it to the car. The rain also damaged my phone to the point where I needed a replacement so yeah I agree and I wish she had rescheduled that show
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u/hermella29 13d ago
This!!!