r/nottheonion • u/MORaHo04 • 15d ago
Boris Johnson turned away from polling station after forgetting to bring photo ID
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/may/02/minister-sorry-as-veterans-find-id-card-not-valid-for-english-elections1
u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.
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u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.
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u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.
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u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.
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u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.
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u/CoatFew7373 14d ago
He could have voted 3 or 4 times in the U.S. Can't be bothered with those pesky id's unless it to get government assistance.
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u/ImaginaryDonut69 14d ago
I mean...the law is fair, but Boris is a bit slow lol. Can't have random people who just fell into a sovereign nation trying to influence elections.
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u/wiredcrusader 14d ago
In the United States requiring ID to vote is somehow "racist." In the rest of the world, it's ABSOLUTELY NORMAL!
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u/spin81 14d ago
We don’t want to see anyone turned away from polling stations, we want everyone to be able to vote. Experience from the last local elections was that 99.75% of people were able to cast their vote successfully.
0.25% of the UK population is roughly 169,000 people. Of course that's an overshoot because not everyone in the UK is elegible to vote - I assume there's a minimal age - still though, that's quite a lot of people. A full city's worth, in fact: that's about the population of Oxford.
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u/Threatening-Silence 14d ago
I don't see any problems with this, in fact it's great. If even celebrities are getting ID checked at the polling station then that means the rules are getting applied equally and properly. That's good for the public perception of the integrity of the vote.
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u/Handpaper 14d ago
Whatever you think of the law, whatever you think of Boris Johnson, I can't think of a better way to spread the message that you must bring ID with you in order to vote.
Johnson isn't stupid, this was done deliberately to generate this story.
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u/grafknives 14d ago
Who are you?' I'm Dean Frantz, I don't need to show you my ID! I mean, cops everywhere, but is there ever a cop when you need one? NO!
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u/ESCF1F2F3F4F5F6F7F8 14d ago edited 14d ago
Whenever he does stuff like this I'm reminded of this story about him: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/my-boris-johnson-story/
tl;dr - he was observed by the writer on two separate occasions turning up late to do a speech and putting on a backstage and on-stage show of ad libbing it in a charmingly bumbling manner, down to 'forgetting' the punchline to exactly the same anecdote both times.
It's all part of an act. He's like your man in The Prestige with the goldfish bowl between his legs - he never switches off his "lol Boris what a lad" performance in public, ever. You saw glimpses of his veil slipping during his being questioned in the COVID Inquiry but 99.99999% of the time literally everything he does is a fucking act. He's done this ID stunt to remain in the headlines for some self-serving reason.
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u/lightninggod3 14d ago
Good. Go back home and grab it. How hard is that. Also, how are you forgetting to bring photo ID? He should know better
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u/Colosphe 14d ago
I've always been impressed by Boris Johnson's political maneuvering - from the "painting buses" thing to distract the populace from the Brexit bus, to the feigned buffoonery, and now this extension of it letting him "show that the system works" because he intentionally failed at it.
I'm not as savvy as I could be on British politics, but is voter ID a race issue in the UK as it is in the US?
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u/Prestigious_Low_2447 14d ago
They have voter ID laws in Europe. Why is it so hard to pass those laws in America?
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u/ArcticKev 14d ago
I truly don’t understand the issue with requiring ID to vote. There’s so many foreign nationals in my country that it’s absolutely necessary to both make sure that only citizens vote and make sure that they are only able to vote once. Once they verify you have eligible for both they just give you 1-3 pieces of paper depending on the election and you shove them in a box with an x in the place of choice, no way to tie your vote to your ID, but they might only be able to tell if you voted or not.
It’s such a pointless thing to get pissy about.
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u/765433bikesinbeijing 14d ago
Sorry for m ignorance, but in my country, everyone has always needed a form of id to vote. Carrying ID at all times is actually mandatory by law - it's not enforced but the expectation exists. Why dies it cause hurdles in countries like the US and UK?
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u/MORaHo04 14d ago
You aren’t required in the UK as long as you bring a valid document to the police station within 2 weeks, this voting ID requirement was only introduced 2 years ago.
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u/765433bikesinbeijing 14d ago
Thanks for the perspective. I think it's the same in my country. Technically I think we are required to carry it, but if we bring it later to the station is fine. We always needed ID to vote.
So in the UK, before, you would just say your name in the voting booth or would you have to say your "ID number" (or something like it) as well?
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u/JaanaLuo 14d ago
I see no problem with this. Picture ID is norm in Nordics for example. No picture ID, no voting.
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u/_Middlefinger_ 14d ago
I suspect this was by design. If he was turned away as he should be then 'that's just Boris being a goof', but if he wasn't he would make a deal of it saying the law isn't being upheld and there is voter fraud.
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u/proshortcut 14d ago
A former US vice president was booted for using the wrong parking spot at my office the other day. it was ADA and he had the placard, but he overstayed the guest parking limit attending the quarterly board meeting.
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14d ago
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u/SnowFlakeUsername2 14d ago
Well that's delicious. Did he have to spend another 2 hours talking the bus home to get his ID? That would be even yummier.
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u/CressCrowbits 14d ago
I expect he would have sent one of his staff to go pick it up from one of his mistress' homes.
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u/Manoj109 14d ago
And this is the man who was PM. The man who brought in the law. If he can't get personal basic admin right how did Tory voters expect to be PM.
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u/ThunderChild247 14d ago
I half expect he did this deliberately. Now people are talking about him again right as Sunak may be in danger. Funny, that.
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u/OtoDraco 14d ago
see democrats? stronger ID standards is a good thing, prevents the wrongthinkers from voting
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u/poopshipdestroyer 15d ago
They pulled this on me when I wrote a line in the ‘sign here’ box on the tablet like I do with all eSignatures. Was unaware the signature was supposed to match to on file to identify myself. I had to show ID after that, and given a different ballot that needed further scrutiny and probably wa only tabulated in case of a close race
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u/tekko001 15d ago
Wonder how it went down:
Officer: "Mr Johnsons can you show me your ID?"
Johnson: Ruffles hair..."Ok I'm coming in"
Officer: "No Mr Johnson, we need you identification papers please"
Johnson: Ruffles hair again and makes a grimace..."Now, please move out of the way!"
Officer: "NO Mr Johnson, YOUR ID!"
Johnson: Ruffling hair intensifies...
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u/cwsjr2323 15d ago
Nebraska had a seven step security system to prevent people from voting illegally by mail. Some counties only did voting by mail. With the hope of disenfranchising unwanted people from voting against them, the Republicans added voter ID required for all voters. This will back fire as the rural counties that only do mail ballots are strongly Republican.
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u/poopshipdestroyer 15d ago
They’re bumbling morons if they think ineligible people will ever cast a vote that counts. ‘Well what did you guys do, take it and something crazy to it?🤨’ What they really are trying to do is make eligible younger voters give up on the process in frustration because people just don’t go for the gop anymore .
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u/cwsjr2323 14d ago
Not all of us old farts think vote for anybody with an R after their name. My wife and I vote against anyone supporting that stinky diaper flatulence.
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u/AH2112 15d ago
There is no way he didn't counter with "Don't you know who I am?"
What an asshole
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u/faithle55 14d ago
"Well ah, haha, I didn't think - hoho - that I would need a, um, a, um a um ID because haha everybody knows who, um, who, um, who I am, haha."
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u/-GoldenHandTheJust- 15d ago
how even is that?
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u/CommandObjective 14d ago
He is not a details guy. Also, he is a man who has a far higher threshold than most of us plebs on what a detail is.
To quote a school report from 1982 to Boris' father:
“Boris really has adopted a disgracefully cavalier attitude to his classical studies . . . Boris sometimes seems affronted when criticised for what amounts to a gross failure of responsibility (and surprised at the same time that he was not appointed Captain of the School for next half): I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception, one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.”
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u/tullystenders 15d ago edited 15d ago
Yet another example of based Britain. In America, there is fierce debate on this issue of needing an ID (maybe a photo ID) to vote. Many say its racist to require it.
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u/Bog-Star 15d ago
So what you're telling me is that he left and got his photo ID and then legally voted thus proving there isn't some massive restriction to a voter ID?
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u/funinnewyork 15d ago
When I see people like Boris Johnson, Sebastian Kurz, Sarkozy, and similar people, I remember the term Ochlocracy(I am not going to even count tyrants, as this post isn’t about them).
100 years from now, history books will state that “and in the new millennium, countries slowly started to realized that the democracy was indeed a lie, at least in most countries. The real ruling system was Ochlocracy.”
Most—if not all—countries were ruled by Ochlocracy; even though, billions of people thought that they were ruled by democracy. By Ochlocracy, don’t think that only countries ruled by tyranny/dictatorship are affected.
Almost all countries are affected. For instance, what we see as a great democracy, such as US, UK, Netherlands, Australia and Canada are affected as well.
For instance, in the US, where there are only two political parties with a chance to have an elected president, or even presented in the senate/house (not abysmally) do you think that all people’s opinions are really represented? With an unbiased mind, consider the people who are actually liberal, socialist, nationalist, communist, globalist, etc. and have no chance of representation. You might hate some of those ideas, and you might love some of those ideas, however, at the end of the day, you are left with two parties. Consider that the republican’s candidate is Bill Cosby (or insert the name you dislike most, and never vote for under any case), and Democrats candidate is Kanye West. What would you do? Still vote for them, or vote for, say, the Green Party, or libertarian party, etc.? Now, think the exact opposite, for centuries, people in opposing views never had the chance to be represented sufficiently in the house or senate. How would they feel?
In the UK, the Brexit decision was a close call (52%-48%). In such a life changing opinion counties such as Northern Ireland, Scotland, and Gibraltar were all effected by the decision of people who they don’t even speak the same language. Gibraltar, for instance, voted 96% in favor of remaining. That is how, 2 people in every 100 people, changed the people’s lives.
Consider that tomorrow, they make a referendum, and say that to decrease income tax from 40% to 20%, and VAT to 1%, every guy at the age of 20, who doesn’t have a mother or father will need to work in a mine for 5 years $1500/month (which will be spent to accommodation and food) 12 hours a day, 6 days a week. What would happen? A few good hearted people and 20 year old guys with no moms/dads will vote no; however, a significant majority of people will vote yes. Is it technically democratic? Depends on your definition of democracy. Is it Ochlocracy? Sure it is.
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u/fingermebarney 15d ago
counties such as Northern Ireland, Scotland, and Gibraltar were all effected by the decision of people who they don’t even speak the same language.
Sorry what?
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u/funinnewyork 14d ago
I should have phrased better, please give it to me being an ESL. What I meant is that they don’t even have a historically common native language, even though they all speak and officially have English. If there are people who don’t know;
The native languages of Northern Ireland, Scotland, and Gibraltar are as follows:
Northern Ireland: The native language is Irish. Ulster Scots is also spoken and recognized as a cultural language.
Scotland: Scottish Gaelic
Gibraltar: Llanito, sort of a combination of Spanish and and English.
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u/fingermebarney 13d ago
they don’t even have a historically common native language
Go back far enough and nobody has that, language was fractured to an obscene extent, in Europe it was not uncommon for priests/politicians/royals to know 3-4 languages.
even though they all speak and officially have English.
That's what I mean, at least the last 5 generations speak English... we all speak the same language as England when brexit happened.
affected by the decision of people who don’t even speak the same language.
Is like saying that in Barcelona they "don’t even speak the same language." as the rest of Spain because they historically spoke Catalan.
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u/wellaby788 15d ago
Hmmm I thought asking for id for voting was racist. Interesting
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
The only people who insist we need voter ID in America still believe the 2020 election was rigged.
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u/redsunmachine 15d ago
I can't help but feel that this is planned.
There were a lot of PofC getting turned away from my polling booth today, and the woman working there said it had been happening 'to loads of people', but the headlines are about BoJo and the fact the most famous person it happened to was white makes the average person think it's happening to everyone.
Fuck this bullshit law and obvious attempt at voter suppression.
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u/CressCrowbits 14d ago
There was a story on R London of people getting turned away for having IDs that were totally valid.
One guy had a South African passport for voting in the London Mayor elections (you don't need to be a UK citizen to vote in that) and the staff at the polling station were like "No! You need a BRITISH passport!" which was totally untrue.
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15d ago
Wait! Photo ID required for voting? What sort of undemocratic chicanery is this?!?!?!?!
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15d ago edited 15d ago
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u/GlassCanner 15d ago
I legitimately can't tell if you're one of the millions of clueless redditors who don't realize most civilized countries have voter ID or if you're parodying that person lol
I hate that
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u/That_Guy_Brody 15d ago
The racist kind!
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u/faithle55 14d ago
It's more to do with the simple fact that in the UK the sort of people that don't have and won't find it easy to get pictorial ID - the young, the old, the infirm, the poor - are far more likely not to vote conservative.
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15d ago
I am confused by your response. Where is the racism in this matter?
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u/AwkwardSquirtles 15d ago
The theory is that if you wanted to, you could look at the demographics of what black people are less likely to possess for socioeconomic reasons and in that way limit their ability to vote in a way which looks mostly innocuous. Getting ID isn't hard, but it does have a cost involved, and black people are statistically poorer on average than white people.
However, given how the Tories lean more towards classism than racism in the UK, it seems to me more likely that the move is generally intended to hurt the poor in general, which just has the side effect of disproportionately affecting ethnic minorities.
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15d ago
Similar to the claims in the US. But, you have me curious because I am otherwise ignorant is the laws of the UK. Is there a requirement to have a national identify card of any kind in the UK?
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u/AwkwardSquirtles 15d ago
No, there's no requirement. Lots of things require one, of course, but there isn't a universal legal requirement that you have photo ID.
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u/That_Guy_Brody 15d ago
In the u.s. voter id is a contentious issue. Requiring photo identification to vote is a race issue here. It’s ridiculous.
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u/Healthy_Training3398 15d ago
It’s ridiculous.
You're right. It's ridiculous that we have such inequality and moronic systems in place in the country that a significant amount of minorities and younger age voters don't have a photo ID to use.
We should probably fix those problems before requiring a law that would disqualify a significant number of eligible voters- despite no evidence of any major election fraud in the country's history, right?
Surely you're not letting your moronic right wing values get in the way of thinking?
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u/Youareobscure 15d ago
In the US the only types of photo ID's are driver's liscenses and driving permits. Both require showing up in person at a DMV and passing tests, meaning there is a barrier for ability to travel as well as an unconstitutional requirement to pass a test. They can also be time intensive to obtain. Whenever photo ID laws are proposed, an easily accessible method of obtaining a photo ID is never proposed with it. No one would mind if these laws contained a method that would make it convenient and free for all citizens to obtain a photo ID, but these laws NEVER do.
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u/poopshipdestroyer 15d ago edited 15d ago
And state IDs which require the same hoops to jump thru(birth certificate, social security card and proof of residence whatever else.etc), minus the drivers test.
Adding to what you said: Ever lose your birth certificate? It’s a fiasco In NY you have to go in person to the county/city records building which is easy if you still live in the same area you were hatched and your family has a car, but if you don’t-it’s likely a total day affair. Easy to see how it is a race issue
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14d ago
birth certificate, social security card and proof of residence
So regular stuff that any adult should have? And that's "racist"?
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u/poopshipdestroyer 14d ago
You never lost one of those? Kudos for having a safe living environment with a safe and whatnot. It’s classist and affects minorities more, what would you call that?
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14d ago
You never lost one of those?
No. One does not just randomly lose important documents. And if I did, I'd immediately get a new one.
with a safe
lol, no.
It’s classist
It isn't.
what would you call that?
A weird political opinion that makes the rest of the world scratch their head.
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u/Jasmith85 14d ago
You have no idea what it's like to grow up poor with shifty parents and it shows.
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14d ago
No, it shows that I don't take these nonsensical statements seriously. I've yet to meet a poor person who didn't have ID.
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u/Jasmith85 14d ago
It's no more nonsensical than idiots who think IDs are needed to stop election fraud, something that doesn't exist.
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u/HawaiianShirtMan 15d ago
Don't states offer State IDs that have a photo on it? It isn't justdriver licenses if that's the case. Also passports (foreign and domestic), military IDs, tribal IDs all have photos on them
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u/the_excalabur 15d ago
And a bunch of people don't have any of these, and the people that don't tend to be poor. Many Americans don't have a passport, for instance. (And a foreign passport certainly wouldn't be accepted...)
It turns out these policies are mostly classist, but because of systematic racism they also turn out to be racist in most circumstances.
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u/Youareobscure 15d ago
Don't states offer State IDs that have a photo on it?
No, at least not all states
It isn't just driver licenses if that's the case. Also passports (foreign and domestic), military IDs, tribal IDs all have photos on them
Passports are not free or cenvenient for everyone to obtain. Military ID's and tribal ID's are not available for everyone.
You need to remember that is is NECESSARY for obtaining a photo ID to be CONVENINENT and FREE to ANY citizen. If those requirements are not met then fewer elligible voters will vote and some people that do vote will face difficulties obtaining the ability to do so.
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u/poopshipdestroyer 15d ago edited 14d ago
A quick googlin will tell you yes all states have state issue IDs
It can still be a shit show getting one
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u/NastyHobits 15d ago
Yes, but the right to vote is enshrined in the constitution, so adding restrictions like ID laws is seen as unconstitutional by many people.
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u/poopshipdestroyer 14d ago
Don’t forget kids When the constitution was created ‘guaranteeing all men the right to vote’ men didn’t mean everyone like we like to think today, it meant white dudes only. Not all white dudes tho, just the ones were wealthy enough to own land. They’re the only dang ones with a lick a dang sense anyway
They’ve always been doing shenanigans to only let their guys vote
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u/Auraxis012 15d ago
By preventing the 2 million people in the UK who are eligible to vote but who have no ID, a population skewed towards ethnic minorities, from voting.
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u/Fishermanfrienamy 15d ago
Whaaat why not take the opportunity for a picture of him. His hair is always entertaining
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u/Zerttretttttt 15d ago
Probly did it on purpose
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u/JustEatinScabs 14d ago
Had to mess up his hair extra bad for this one! Look at me I'm just a harmless silly Billy!
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u/Striking_Fun_6379 15d ago
That's encouraging. It means one day, when England is not under the influence of Russian propaganda, he may be turned away from the UK.
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u/circa_1996 15d ago
Who the fuck can even be arsed with the colossal waste of oxygen ruling class we have here?
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u/PM_me_random_facts89 15d ago
This is a good thing
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u/ultrafud 15d ago
No it's absolutely not.
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u/HawaiianShirtMan 15d ago
That he was turned away or that a photo ID was needed for voting?
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u/ultrafud 14d ago
Obviously the latter. I don't give a shit about Boris's bad fortune, but it's symptomatic of a policy which disenfranchises voters and is designed, in principle, to benefit the Tories.
Anyone that thinks it's a good thing is an idiot. Fuck the downvotes.
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u/DeathHopper 15d ago
Photo ID for voting?!
Confused American noises
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u/Narren_C 15d ago
I'll never understand why this is so controversial. You need an ID to do anything, who are these people in society that don't have one?
I've been a police officer for many years. I speak from experience when I say that virtually everyone carries an ID. Elderly people have them, young adults have them, homeless people have them. Everyone has one because you need one for so many things.
If someone is indigent then I have no issue with them being able to obtain an ID for free, so if that's the hang up then we can require that as an attachment to voter ID laws.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
It's because it's pointless to ask for ID. You already have to prove who you are when you register to vote. A lot of countries don't have preregistration so it makes sense for them to ask for identification.
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u/MaievSekashi 15d ago
who are these people in society that don't have one?
The prime minister apparently
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u/TheLizardKing89 15d ago
It’s controversial because it isn’t about vote security, it’s about voter suppression. When Alabama passes a voter ID law and then closes the DMV offices in majority black neighborhoods, it’s pretty obvious what the goal of the policy is.
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u/powercow 15d ago
Because republicans are doing it because minorities and young people are the least likely to have one. In my state, 30% of voting age black males do NOT have an ID valid for an election. and its also why republicans will allow gun licenses but not college ids.
and remember this same party that says the DMV is legit enough to give you an ID to vote with, demand you cant register to vote at the DMV.
they have been threatening to do a national voter ID act to get dems votes on certain things since the 80s.
we dont have an in person voting fraud problem.. we do have a voter purging problem.
Republicans solely push voter ID because twice as many black people than white people are missing one and the very next largest group without an ID are the under 25, especially today with all the E bikes and the expense of getting a car.
Also its kinda horseshit you need an ID for everything, in rural areas, where most black people dont have an id, every bar tender knows them because they were there when they were born. and if you dont have an ID you can also get shit from friends. and believe it or not the poor dont fly a lot. Its kinda crazy how 30% of voting age, drinking aged black people in my state, can live just fine without an ID, with the sole exception of voting. and in some of our rural areas, the DMV is open one day a month.
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u/poopshipdestroyer 15d ago
It’s classist to refuse to believe that it can be difficult for the poor to get an ID
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u/TerrapinTribe 15d ago
Because it costs money to get an ID. It’s a poll tax.
It also requires you to stand in line for hours when the DMVs are only open 9-5 Monday - Friday, so you have to miss an entire day of work and lose those wages, furthering the poll tax.
And hey, by the way, none of those DMVs are near bus stops or other public transport. So if you don’t have a car, you need someone else to bring you, or call an expensive taxi.
For a salaried person, you can miss the work. If your poor and hourly, it’s expensive, and its hurdle upon hurdle.
Photo ID requirements are solely done to prevent the poor from voting.
In my home state of Missouri, you must use a Missouri ID, not a valid out of state. So if you just moved there, and registered per the requirements by showing proof of address, but haven’t had the time to get a Missouri drivers license, well, you can’t vote.
I’d be more supportive of these efforts if getting a photo ID was completely free for everyone without onerous requirements to prove you need it, getting all documents required to obtain said photo ID completely free (certified birth certificate), and must provide reasonable transportation (maybe the police could use their services door to door) to get to the DMV, completely free of charge. And the DMVs need to be open 7am-8PM every day of the week.
Of course, none of those things are going to happen, because it’s the intention of these laws to prevent the most poor and vulnerable in our society from voting.
By the way do you ever speak to any homeless? Because the chance of them ever getting an ID, or any documentation needed for it, are slim to none.
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u/Narren_C 15d ago
By the way do you ever speak to any homeless? Because the chance of them ever getting an ID, or any documentation needed for it, are slim to none.
I've worked with the homeless population for years, and any time I ever took a report I asked for ID. I can't recall anyone ever not having an ID.
I get that getting an ID can be a hassle in some places and it needs to be made easier, but having an ID is so important for so many reasons that I almost never encounter someone who has never had one.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
So where is all this vote stealing happening besides the many Republicans that have tried it and gotten caught?
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u/TerrapinTribe 15d ago
But it wasn’t made easier when these laws were passed. The lawmakers knew the documentation and time requirements were onerous, and deliberately chose to do nothing about it. It’s a feature, not a bug.
Plus the poor sap who forgot to renew their drivers license in time and therefore was denied their right to vote. In Missouri your photo ID must not be expired at all. Even a day late they took away your right to vote.
It’s a poll tax. Was always designed that way.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
You can get your ID for free in the US. The idea of this being some sort of tool of oppression is misinformation.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
The idea that elections can be stolen is so ridiculous.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/senate-panel-finds-russia-interfered-in-the-2016-us-election
Keep that same energy when it comes to this then.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
Yes, the Republicans in the Senate acknowledged that Russia interfered in the election, but that does that have to do with voter ID and Republicans lying about voter fraud?
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
I was responding to your original comment:
The idea that elections can be stolen is so ridiculous.
You can't believe that Russia interfered with one of our elections and then turn around and claim that the idea that an election can be stolen (aka interfered with) is a ridiculous idea.
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u/Diarygirl 14d ago
I'm not sure why you're confused by the difference between voter fraud and election interference. Here's a really huge hint: Hillary conceded the election immediately and she never attempted a coup.
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u/tallman11282 15d ago
Social security cards are NOT valid identification by themselves. They require another form of valid ID to themselves be valid because there's nothing on them that positively identifies that the person with the card is who the card belongs to, no picture, no description, nothing.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago edited 14d ago
Some states allow social security cards as ID when voting.
All states that require photo ID allow you to use a Voter ID. Each of these states allow you to get a Voter ID for free.
Most of these states allow you to get a Voter’s ID online.You are spreading misinformation.
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u/thirdegree 14d ago
As established, it's you spreading misinformation.
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u/BallsackMessiah 14d ago
The part that I was incorrect on was not the main point that was being discussed. It was an additional point.
The rest of my comment still stands as correct.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
You're spreading the idea that elections can be rigged. It's the same bullshit for the past seven years, all because your guy is the world's biggest sore loser.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago edited 15d ago
You're spreading the idea that elections can be rigged.
Can you tell me where I said that?
It's the same bullshit for the past seven years, all because your guy is the world's biggest sore loser.
I voted for Clinton in 2016 and Biden in 2020.
all because your guy is the world's biggest sore loser.
It was a popular sentiment among the left between 2017-2021 that Russia had interfered with the 2016 election. This is hardly a one-sided complaint about elections.
I find it a bit ironic that you would claim that elections can't possibly be rigged and state that Trump is a sore loser, meanwhile multiple states attempted to remove Trump from their ballots before he had been convicted of a federal crime in court. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, including people you hate.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
It is one-sided though. The Republicans are the only ones that consistently lie about elections being rigged and why they insist we need voter ID. It's just a fact that if you say voter ID is necessary, it means you believe that elections are rigged because why else would you think ID is necessary?
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
why else would you think ID is necessary?
To prevent fraud? Doesn't mean that I think each election is rigged, or that the 2020 election was rigged. But I still think that photo IDs should be implemented in order to prevent fraudulent votes. There's been over 1,000 convictions in voter fraud since 2000. This isn't an epidemic by any means, but it does happen, and it is possible.
It is one-sided though.
It's only one-sided right now because the year is 2024 and the Republicans lost the most recent election. It was one-sided in the opposite direction in 2017, and in 2001.
Not a lot of people who win an election are going to claim that they rigged it.
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u/TerrapinTribe 15d ago
That’s a social security card.
We’re talking about photo IDs here. You know, the ones you need to stand in line in for at the DMV that’s only open Monday - Friday 9AM-5PM.
I don’t disagree you should show ID. Photo ID is much more onerous. And that’s why these laws are passed, to disenfranchise poor voters.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago edited 15d ago
It only becomes an issue when you need to actually pay for a photo ID in order to vote. But you do not. Every state that requires a photo ID, allows you to use a Voter's ID which is free. Most states allow you to get a voter's ID completely online as well. So if you're poor and traveling to a government office is difficult, or you're not able to get time off during normal office hours, you can do it from a public library, from home, or from your phone.
Even if Voter IDs were not free, Driver's Licenses in most states are either free or require a fee of less than $35. You need a Driver's License for about 1/3 of the things you do in the United States.
I do not understand how this is an issue. If you want to argue that requiring Driver's Licenses is a class issue, I can sort of understand since maybe some people might not be able to afford a Driver's License because they don't need it but would still like to be able to vote.
But making it a racial issue is beyond ridiculous. Whenever people make the claim that this sort of thing is racist towards minority groups, it just makes you look like you think black people are too stupid to figure out how to get a driver's license. It ends up making those claiming this seem like they think minority groups are children. It's bizarre and gross.
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u/Diarygirl 15d ago
Why do you think voter ID is necessary? It seems like most advocates of it aren't at all familiar with the voting process and seem to think that stealing someone's identity to vote is commonplace.
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u/TerrapinTribe 15d ago edited 15d ago
So now you’re going from it’s free to get a social security card (which is not a valid form of ID in voter ID states) to it’s no problem to you can get a free voter ID if you need one. Cool. Way to lay out your viewpoint clear and full in the beginning.
You’re attacking the straw man here. Never did I once in this thread bring up race. Don’t know where you’re getting this. I mentioned poor people and I don’t make the mental leap between poor people and race.
Can you please elaborate why you brought up race in your comment to me, even though I never brought it up myself?
Even if the documents to get a photo ID are free themselves, the cost is extremely high for poor people as I pointed out before.
DMVs in places are only open during normal work hours, usually 9AM to 5PM Monday through Friday. Those are the hours when poor people work so they lose wages going to the DMV. DMVs are notoriously understaffed so you end up waiting hours. You could lose up to a day’s wages which might mean your family not eating that day.
Fuck man I make decent money salaried and going to the DMV for me is still a major pain in the ass and costs me hours of my time. When you’re poor, the choice between doing that or keeping food on your table is clear.
DMVs are usually not placed near public transport. So if you’re poor and don’t have a car, you need to rely on someone else (who is also missing work) or take a relatively expensive taxi.
These are simply not options for the most poor and vulnerable in society. It’s a privilege to make enough money where not working 4-8 hours that week won’t make you go hungry. But there’s plenty of people where it does.
You don’t need a photo ID to walk down the street. You don’t need a photo ID to buy groceries. You don’t even need a photo ID even to fly commercial (but the TSA will give you a lengthy pat down) We are not a Soviet Union “paper’s please” society (yet).
Without solving or even acknowledging the above major hurdles to getting a photo ID for poor people, the intentions of the lawmakers who are passing these laws are clear, disenfranchise poor people from voting.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
So now you’re going from it’s free to get a social security card (which is not a valid form of ID in voter ID states) to it’s no problem to you can get a free voter ID if you need one. Cool. Way to lay out your viewpoint clear and full in the beginning.
This doesn't negate any of what I said as being true. It's still true whether I said all of it upfront or in a follow up comment.
Can you please elaborate why you brought up race in your comment to me, even though I never brought it up myself?
Sorry, I've been reading and responding to a dozen other comments in this comment chain, so I got things mixed up with who said what. There are other comments here who solely focused on it being a race issue, rather than a poverty issue. Which is why I addressed race in my comment. But you're right. You didn't mention it, so I didn't need to bring it up. I don't really have problems with your overall sentiment and concern after re-reading your original comment.
DMVs in places are only open during normal work hours, usually 9AM to 5PM Monday through Friday. Those are the hours when poor people work so they lose wages going to the DMV. DMVs are notoriously understaffed so you end up waiting hours. You could lose up to a day’s wages which might mean your family not eating that day.
Fuck man I make decent money salaried and going to the DMV for me is still a major pain in the ass and costs me hours of my time. When you’re poor, the choice between doing that or keeping food on your table is clear.
DMVs are usually not placed near public transport. So if you’re poor and don’t have a car, you need to rely on someone else (who is also missing work) or take a relatively expensive taxi.
These are simply not options for the most poor and vulnerable in society. It’s a privilege to make enough money where not working 4-8 hours that week won’t make you go hungry. But there’s plenty of people where it does.
I understand, which is why Voter IDs are available online. If there are areas where this is not the case, or if the law ends up being that it needs to be a Driver's License, then while I wouldn't be as upset about it, I would agree that this would make a lot of people have to jump through hoops in order to vote unless they change the accessibility of getting a DL.
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u/TerrapinTribe 15d ago
Photo IDs are not available in my state of Missouri online. You need to go in to provide your documentation (birth certificate, social security card) and take your picture.
What US states allow you to get a photo ID online completely?
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
I didn't say that all states offer it online. I said most do, and most states do allow you to get a Voter ID online.
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u/Auraxis012 15d ago
Over 14,000 people were turned away from voting centres last year, skewed towards working class and ethnic minorities, while approximately 2 million people are eligible to vote but have no ID.
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u/CarbonFlavored 14d ago
How hard is it to get an ID
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u/Auraxis012 14d ago
According to a predictive study regarding the next general election, prohibitively so for over 1.1 million people.
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u/Narren_C 15d ago
In the US? I'm asking because of how your spelled center.
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u/Auraxis012 15d ago
In the UK. I don't know the exact numbers for the US but I believe they're skewed in a similar way.
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u/Helpful_Blood_5509 15d ago
No we drive around here. Everyone has a driver's license unless they're elderly
Then they have nondrivers licenses lol
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u/Auraxis012 14d ago
You got me curious so I had a quick check. According to the Center for Democracy and Civic Engagement, about 15% of the US population don't have photo ID that they can use at the ballot box. That 15% skews poor, ethnic minority, and Democrat.
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u/CressCrowbits 14d ago
Everyone has a driver's license unless they're elderly
That is extremely untrue
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u/minineko 15d ago
I think most people would have no issue with voter ID laws if it was guaranteed that everyone could get a a valid ID easily and quickly for free.
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u/RNZTH 14d ago
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u/minineko 11d ago
That's great! I know very little about UK politics. Making IDs very hard to obtain in certain areas has historically been used as a voter suppression tactic in the USA.
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u/Helpful_Blood_5509 15d ago
My state is alabama and you can get photo id's for free. There are bill boards advertising this in high traffic urban areas. You can get nondriver photo ids too
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
https://www.ssa.gov/number-card/replace-card
It is free in the US. Here you go.
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u/minineko 15d ago
✓ Free ? Easy ? Quick
One down, two to go! That page does suggest you need to bring ID to get ID, so it's not helpful if you don't have any ID.
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u/TheLizardKing89 15d ago
A social security card doesn’t have a photo on it. How could it be used as ID?
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u/tallman11282 15d ago
That's not a valid photo ID as voter ID laws require.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
Some states allow social security cards as ID when voting.
All states that require photo ID allow you to use a Voter ID. Each of these states allow you to get a Voter ID for free. Most of these states allow you to get a Voter's ID online.
You are spreading misinformation.
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u/Lethal-Sloth 15d ago
I think most people would have no issue with voter ID laws if it was guaranteed that everyone could get a a valid ID easily and quickly for free.
https://www.gov.uk/apply-for-photo-id-voter-authority-certificate
You can get a free ID if you don't have another. According to another page, you had to apply by 25th April, that was 1 week before the local elections.
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u/DeadpooI 15d ago
They're talking about the US.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
You can also get a free government ID in the US.
https://www.ssa.gov/number-card/replace-card
Here you go. Very simple.
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u/tallman11282 15d ago
That's not a valid photo ID as voter ID laws require.
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
Some states allow social security cards as ID when voting.
All states that require photo ID allow you to use a Voter ID. Each of these states allow you to get a Voter ID for free. Most of these states allow you to get a Voter's ID online.
You are spreading misinformation.
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u/DeadpooI 15d ago
You just posted a link to a social security card when we are talking about Photo ID's. Have you ever seen a social security card?
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u/BallsackMessiah 15d ago
Some states allow social security cards as ID when voting.
All states that require photo ID allow you to use a Voter ID. Each of these states allow you to get a Voter ID for free. Most of these states allow you to get a Voter's ID online.
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u/Jojobebe3334 14d ago
This is just him trying to change the history. Now when you search boris voting id. You get this story rather than news about him implementing this law. Same as if you search boris London buses.