r/nba • u/achickenquesadilla Heat • Apr 22 '24
[Highlight] Overhead angle of Jrue Holiday shoving Caleb Martin directly into Jayson Tatum Awful video quality
https://streamable.com/qlo1q4[removed] — view removed post
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u/Longjumping_Gain_807 Celtics Apr 23 '24
I don’t hate Caleb Martin for this. I hate him for what he did to the Celtics last year
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u/Videogamesandshiz Celtics Apr 22 '24
Oh damn. Originally I thought it was just a hand on the back, not nearly enough to send him flying into Tatum.
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u/UrsulasAnus Apr 22 '24
I want an apology lol. This place went stupid yesterday but I stood my ground. I'm just a hero like that.
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u/Sss00099 Heat Apr 22 '24
Jrue picks up the blitzing linebacker really well on that play, gave Brady an extra second or two in the pocket to make the pass.
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u/EndlessCola Celtics Apr 22 '24
This is an insane cut of the clip. Regardless of whether Jrue pushed him he had way more than enough time to avoid contact. Even in the best read of this play CM was negligent in running full speed from the 3 line to the hoop and didn’t pay attention to where he was going. This could have been waaaaay worse and no Jrue didn’t push him into anyone. At normal speed you can see him move away from Jrue and yet maintain his same path totally unaffected
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u/chengman21 Heat Apr 23 '24
Explain why Jrue felt the need to put his hands on Caleb’s back then, if not to interfere with his movements towards the basket. Why not just let him get past? What does putting his hands of Caleb achieve in this place, if according to everyone, Caleb was out to injure Tatum from the beginning.
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u/3s2ng Lakers Apr 22 '24
So what now? We already heard all the Boston fans said the Heat are dirty and Spo planned it.
What am I gonna do with this new piece of information? Will the Boston fans apologize?
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u/jhcooke98 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Tatum seems to be the only one that doesn't give a shit about this play
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u/hk0125 76ers Apr 22 '24
I think it’s deleted because this footage is edited. Looks like a frame or two was removed to makes it look more forceful than it is (the push by Jrue).
Does anyone have unedited version?
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u/ThiccPapaSIZZLE Heat Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 22 '24
This getting removed is why I can’t take this sub seriously. Mods recklessly controlling how information is received and perceived on a forum with 10 million + people is ridiculous
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u/sheetrocker88 [BOS] Tommy Heinson Apr 22 '24
Also if Bam was where Tatum was do you think Caleb hits Bam with the same force or controls himself better? I still think Caleb 100% knew what he was doing, if Jrue doesn’t touch him the same exact outcome happens in my opinion. Jrue isn’t that strong and there was 60 seconds left in a 16 point game , Caleb wanted to get physical
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u/BAMdalorian Heat Apr 22 '24
Stop. Get help. If you see this video and still have to grasp at dIrTy PlAyEr, you legit have a problem
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u/DUCKY_23 Heat Apr 22 '24
Lol now this thread is removed
Mods are fucking garbage
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u/Shinnaminbuns Celtics Apr 22 '24
It's clearly heavily edited to make the push look more consequential. That's why it was removed, because it's doctored.
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u/BAMdalorian Heat Apr 22 '24
Because it doesn’t fit the narrative lmao
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u/TormentedLoL Celtics Apr 22 '24
Just throwing this out here cause I'm curious about a Heat fan's take.
Isn't the Heat team being an extremely physical team that pushes the boundary on dirty vs basketball plays their own narrative at this point? The IST decal they put on their paint literally says "toughest, meanest, nastiest"; these usually aren't superlatives used to describe a team that doesn't even slightly acknowledge that they toe the line (not commenting in the perspective of this particular play, just in general confused as to why the Heat's physicality and thus tendency to cause injury is construed as a media/Celtics/Knicks narrative when it seems like even the Heat's own front office perpetuates it)
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u/302born Heat Apr 22 '24
There’s a difference between being dirty and being physical. We play physical brand of basketball. That’s always been the kind of basketball the Heat have played. But there’s no intent to injure people. That’s the most annoying narrative to read on here because it’s ridiculous. Most of these players are friends anyway. Why would they want to injure each other? The culture narrative is built on hard work and giving everything. So that’s where the physical play is derived from. But no where in that is trying to purposely injure other players. That’s ridiculous.
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u/TormentedLoL Celtics Apr 22 '24
Right but there are other ways to describe that like "Gritty" or "Relentless" or something closer to how the Grit n Grind Grizzlies described themselves. If I hear Toughest, Meanest, Nastiest, the assumption is gonna go in the way of closer to say the Bad Boy Pistons than the Tony Allen Grizz. Do you think the front office is somewhat culpable for the perspective is what I'm asking I guess
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u/Tundraaa [CHI] E'Twaun Moore Apr 22 '24
Why is this post deleted
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u/302born Heat Apr 22 '24
Because Celtics fans (mods) have had their narrative proven wrong and now calling it edited footage to make it disappear
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u/sheetrocker88 [BOS] Tommy Heinson Apr 22 '24
Is this video edited? It looks to be slow down and sped up to make the push look worst. Caleb still knew what he was doing Jrue isn’t that strong
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u/hoagieclu 76ers Apr 22 '24
to preserve player safety, i think boston should sit their starters for the remainder of the playoffs
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u/StreetCryptographer3 Apr 22 '24
Wow. People really believe Jrue shoved Martin into Tatum intentionally? 🤡🤡🤡
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u/laguirre003 Bulls Apr 22 '24
I saw Caleb Martin looking at the ball at the original angle, never at Tatum, making it telling he was going for a rebound, but people already made up their minds that it was a dirty play lol
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u/GodlySpaghetti Thunder Apr 22 '24
I bet the Heat fans that got downvote brigades by Celtics fans are feeling very vindicated. The way people acted in that post yesterday was embarrassing lmfao, talking about how dirty this is and how Martin should be suspended.
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u/302born Heat Apr 22 '24
Most of those Celtics fans are just gonna ignore this and keep pushing their narrative. While the rest are in here calling it edited lol
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u/Thehelloman0 Spurs Apr 22 '24
But not our Jrue! Couldn't be precious Jrue! Stealing them blind! And HE gets to be a star player? What a sick joke!
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u/BigBoss5050 Heat Apr 22 '24
But I got downvoted to hell yesterday pointing this out. Fuck most Celtics and Knicks fans lol.
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u/HughJazkoc [CHI] Dennis Rodman Apr 22 '24
Thank you for this angle, I honestly thought Martin's boxout was dirty as hell. Now I know
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u/KindSpectacle Heat Apr 22 '24
CELTICS FANS WHERE YOU AT NOW?! FOH.
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u/ignoramus_x Celtics Apr 22 '24
Right here. Keep coping with doctored clips, headass.
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u/KindSpectacle Heat Apr 22 '24
DOCTORED CLIP LOL. You sound like a fucking conspiracy theory moron. It isn’t doctored in anyway.
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u/ignoramus_x Celtics Apr 22 '24
It is a doctored clip, you're objectively wrong. If you think pointing that out makes me sound like a conspiracy theory moron, that says more about you than me. Check your water pipes for lead, I hear that's a problem down in florida.
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u/BAMdalorian Heat Apr 22 '24
These fans are seriously deranged lmao
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Apr 22 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/BAMdalorian Heat Apr 22 '24
It’s doctored cuz a frame skips after the action happens? How stupid is this fanbase. You can see jrue do the same thing in other angles lmao
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u/ignoramus_x Celtics Apr 22 '24
Yes that's how clips are doctored. Frame skip during the push to make it look faster, and frames cut out when Caleb jumping into Tatum so it looks like he just fell into him rather than jumping into him. "Legendz" has done this exact trick before, and was caught for it. You might think I'm stupid for seeing what you don't, but to me you come across as absolutely pathetic and dense.
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u/BAMdalorian Heat Apr 22 '24
You can literally watch Jrue push him in the live clip from the broadcast. You all are delusional af lmao
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u/Statalyzer Apr 22 '24
The real clincher should have been that Holiday himself wasn't pissed at Martin afterward - if he had done nothing himself, then as the guy with the closest and best view of Martin he'd have been pretty pissed even if he was smart enough to not try and start something.
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u/BoSocks91 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Heat fans can hold onto this moment - it’s the only win they’ll get.
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u/toastyshenanigans Celtics Apr 22 '24
I see Jrue shove -> Martin takes 2 more steps -> launches himself horizontally into a mid air Tatum. Still a reckless play from Martin.
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u/Dolphhins Heat Apr 22 '24
The hate boner for the Heat yesterday was generational. They were literally seeing red and ignoring video evidence
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u/UBKUBK NBA Apr 22 '24
In the aftermath of the play Brown and Martin got a technical. What did Martin do to warrant it?
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u/instantur Celtics Apr 22 '24
How is this anywhere near enough contact to send him flying into Tatums back
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u/LakerUp Apr 22 '24
All of the alumnus from Harvard and MIT combined could not raise the collective retahhhd IQ of Boston fans who are still unable to admit this was Jrue Holiday’s fault and no one else’s (he didn’t intend to shove him into Tatum of course).
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u/i-piss-excellence32 Knicks Apr 22 '24
He barely pushed him. Gtfoh. I am a heat hater though to be fair
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
I am a hater of both teams and I still think it's extremely reckless and unnecessary for Martin to do that
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u/Dangerous-Fan4594 Celtics Apr 22 '24
This clip is so heavily edited. Dw heat fans, y'all aren't dirty at all... Let the copium continue!
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u/chengman21 Heat Apr 23 '24
Any tips? Y’all been coping hard since ‘08.
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u/Dangerous-Fan4594 Celtics Apr 23 '24
Y'all are GOATs, I could never give advice to greatness. I'm just trolling on the Internet, any advice?
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u/fckredditbands23 San Francisco Warriors Apr 22 '24
Bruh they were so many dirty celtics fans calling Caleb dirty, I assume they'll keep that same bitch ass energy and call jrue dirty now too?
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u/LiesOfPushinP Lakers Apr 22 '24
Celtics fans already grabbed their pitchforks and made up their minds unfortunately. This isn’t a dirty play from Martin, tough look for Jrue though.
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u/ignoramus_x Celtics Apr 22 '24
This clip is literally edited with frames cut out. Gimme a fuckin break.
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u/chungardian Apr 25 '24
God it’s just sad seeing the insane copium at this point
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u/ignoramus_x Celtics Apr 25 '24
You trolling an old deleted reddit post = sad person fluffing a fragile ego
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u/D-Flash16 Heat Apr 22 '24
Yet I’ve seen plenty of idiots on here claim that this was an intentional “bee line tackle” by Martin, and Holiday has no fault, granted most of those idiots are fans from Boston, NY, or Portland, so being an idiot comes with the territory.
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u/acelleb Heat Apr 22 '24
That Brian ex-bench warmer player should apologize to Coach Spo. What an idiot.
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u/trenderkazz [BOS] James Posey Apr 22 '24
It was obvious he got a little extra speed but the momentum was already carrying him into Tatum.
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u/HelloS0n Celtics Apr 22 '24
I said Jrue was at fault yesterday when it happened and had some DMs from fellow Celtic flairs/fans asking who the fuck I really root for lol 🤷🏻♂️
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u/WranglerTraditional8 Apr 22 '24
Ha... Well we were big wrong here in Celtic nation.
Moving on to game 2
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u/CraftyMuthafucka Nets Apr 22 '24
No no.
The guys in the other thread said this was 100% dirty, and NOTHING could convince them otherwise.
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u/gmunoz14 Apr 22 '24
I noticed the pushing movement too, but needed this angle to really see the power behind it. At the end of the day glad Tatum is aight.
If he wasn’t, unfortunately Martin would’ve gotten the heat without this angle.
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u/klizmik Warriors Apr 22 '24
There were a shit ton of boston fans in the other threads. Why don’t I see much of them here?
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u/TheyCallMeNick_1 [BOS] Larry Bird Apr 22 '24
I never understood why it was thought to be a dirty play, it just seemed like contact while both players were going for the ball. Falls like this happen? Idk maybe I'm missing something. But I didn't see this angle which just further proves this isn't dirty or malicious.
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u/Ode1st [MIA] Alonzo Mourning Apr 22 '24
I guess Scalabrine now has to say Mazzulla drew up that play specifically to take out Tatum.
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u/RoyKites Lakers Apr 22 '24
I guess everyone blowing themselves saying ”Heat dirty!!!” In the other thread can kick rocks lol
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u/dimiderv Apr 22 '24
I kept commenting this but no one cared yesterday. Heat suck for playing dirty sometimes but this one was not.
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u/Sherlock_House Knicks Apr 22 '24
You know what, this is too confusing. Kick both teams out of the post season. Only fair
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u/SilentExercise2076 Knicks Apr 22 '24
glad there's an angle so clear that even blind Boston homers have to concede it was a push. truly embarrassing comment section yesterday. if you're running even at half speed a small push can throw your momentum in an entirely different direction or speed you up instantly.
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u/Hammii44 Lakers Apr 22 '24
THIS!! especially if it comes at an angle that doesn’t counteract the force, but changes the direction while simultaneously adding to the momentum you’re already moving with. Of course it’s likely you’ll lose a bit of control. That’s exactly what happened
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u/hebelehoo Bulls Apr 22 '24
The other thread looks so stupid right now lol
And tbh given Martin's reaction it wasn't clear cut dirty play regardless of this new angle.
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u/CarBallAlex Celtics Apr 22 '24
Martin clearly got pushed here enough where he’s not at fault. And what Scalabrine said is dumb, obviously no one ordered a hit, that’s reckless as a professional.
Caleb Martin is still a bum and fuck the Heat
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u/MostlyPurple Heat Apr 22 '24
Lmao watching this and then going back to the original comments. 4.5k upvotes on a Celtics fan with a blanket statement about how dirty the Heat are.
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u/Adoree25 Pistons Apr 22 '24
Anyone that acted as if this wasn't dirty was downvoted to shit yesterday. It was obvious it wasn't, but people really do just follow the crowd.
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u/Nuggets_Bt_Newer Nuggets Apr 22 '24
Yeah it's pretty easy to see him lose balance, he coulda still throw himself into Tatum but i REALLY doubt it.
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u/mostlychessiguess Celtics Apr 22 '24
Yeah this angle’s way better. I had comments in the other thread arguing the shove wasn’t that bad and that the momentum shift wasn’t that much, but he definitely looks like he stumbles after the shove. I’m dumb that’s jrues fault
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u/ThatHotAsian Timberwolves Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 22 '24
This sub is actually the worst fucking sub on reddit no cap. I don't even like the Heat but they are all owed apologies
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u/mattislinx Celtics Apr 22 '24
I know Miami is known to pull some shit, but it didn't strike me as a dirty play in real time. I rewound it a few times and could tell he got pushed.
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u/Prudent_Move_3420 Heat Apr 22 '24
Someone needs to take a look at the mods of this sub because someone tried to shutdown every point of discussion about this that suggested it might not have been on purpose
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u/Drain_Surgeon69 Apr 22 '24
4D chess move:
Bucks trade Jrue with the mission to unsettle the Celtics. Blazers were in on it.
Jrue lulls them into a false sense of security by playing just spectacularly all year. Then when the playoffs come? Bam execute order 34.
Jrue never stopped being a Buck.
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u/ApoliticalAth3ist Apr 22 '24
It even looks like Caleb tried to avoid contact
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u/Hammii44 Lakers Apr 22 '24
not only that, you could see he was genuinely concerned immediately after the collision. They pushed him away when he tried to do so as if he did it all on purpose though. That’s probably what egged it on so far as well
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u/Statalyzer Apr 22 '24
Also, note that Holiday (who, if he hadn't pushed, would have been the guy who just saw the whole thing from nearby with a perfect angle) wasn't pissed at Martin at all.
If he had done nothing he would have been the first guy there.
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u/paddiction [SAS] Tim Duncan Apr 22 '24
Jrue Holiday is a dirty player. No place in the NBA for plays like that
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u/nideak Apr 22 '24
Just went through the original thread of the play. So many stupid ass celtics fans whining like 2 year olds and not one of them are gonna admit how fucking stupid they were being.
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u/Deep_Worldliness3122 Heat Apr 22 '24
Spo is next level clearly he put caleb in the exact spot he knew jrue was going to shove him into caleb. What a dirty coach
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u/LgDietCoke Apr 22 '24
What’s with the missing frames right at contact and the sudden ending? It’s not that people denied the shove, it’s that he used the shove as a reason to throw his body right into Tatum. The debate is whether or not he was able to avoid the contract or not. None of this would’ve happened if Holliday didn’t shove him, but I’m saying Martin definitely seized the opportunity and intentionally took his legs out from under him.
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u/marcoarroyo Apr 22 '24
You've never played basketball let alone sports. Go to the local park and play some pick up basketball for once in your life.
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24
Why aren’t you asking about the same blip at the beginning of the video? Same exact thing. What’s the manipulation in THAT little missing frame, Mr Zapruder?
You too /u/Ok-Discipline9998
Just saying guys, get your conspiracy glasses off. OP just has a busted ass video from someone who lost a game of tug of war with the editing software lol
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
I know it could happen because I saw it happen. Dozens of times, in similar situations. Mfers be using those same tricks again to "prove" their player didn't travel, didn't foul, or didn't foul intentionally. Oldest tricks in the book, yet works 100% of the times if you're lucky enough to get them trending.
This clip just ticks too many boxes for me to not apply the "if it looks like a duck" theorem.
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24
I know the type of posts you’re talking about, I do.
This clip just ticks too many boxes for me to not apply the "if it looks like a duck" theorem.
This post is not a duck though. There’s nothing in those blips that would change anything about what is being seen. AND you’re ignoring the fact there’s an identical blip far before the contact with Martin and Tatum.
The manipulation you describe definitely exists I know what you mean, but it’s not here. This is just a shitty video edited for no reason.
Occam’s razor ought to come far before ‘it looks like other amateur video edits I’ve seen’
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Weird, because my Occam's razor has shaved off the exact possibility you're talking about.
Adding artificial imperfection after faking stuff up isn't rocket science, even a kid would know you gotta make a mistake or two if you found a perfect solution for your homework set.
And also, assuming key frames are left off during the edit, the addition of them could theoretically change the perception of everything e.g. exact trajectory of movement, intensity of contact, etc. A little imperfection CAN and DO change the whole picture since we're talking about an insane level of detail and precision.
My opinion is the same, Martin was unnecessarily reckless when crashing for a board in the garbage time, not seeming to care that he might injure somebody. The push from Jrue was, in my damn honest opinion, not remotely strong enough to change the aforementioned statement.
Lastly for those of y'all who tell people to "play basketball": I've met a fair share of self-proclaimed "hustlers" and what they usually mean is that they don't give a shit about annoying or injuring anybody as long as they get the steal/board. I could only wish they dare to hustle like that in some other neighborhoods.
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 30 '24
Adding artificial imperfection after faking stuff up isn't rocket science, even a kid would know you gotta make a mistake or two if you found a perfect solution for your homework set.
And also, assuming key frames are left off during the edit, the addition of them could theoretically change the perception of everything e.g. exact trajectory of movement, intensity of contact, etc. A little imperfection CAN and DO change the whole picture since we're talking about an insane level of detail and precision.
Now do you concede to my point
Same user doing edits. Same weird blips. Absolutely zero reason there would be some agenda behind the cuts here.
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 22 '24
Adding artificial imperfection after faking stuff up isn't rocket science, even a kid would know you gotta make a mistake or two if you found a perfect solution for your homework set.
This is not Occam’s Razor, you’re adding levels of complexity to the theory, not seeking the simplest answer.
Lastly for those of y'all who tell people to "play basketball": I've met a fair share of self-proclaimed "hustlers" and what they usually mean is that they don't give a shit about annoying or injuring anybody as long as they get the steal/board. I could only wish they dare to hustle like that in some other neighborhoods.
I’m sorry my friend, but I’ll absolutely have to play that card on you as well. I played a high level of ball, you’re running full speed to time a follow or board, and you get two-hand-shoved in the middle of your stride, it shows his strength and balance that Martin didn’t veer or stumble further off his path than he did.
There’s no stopping or controlling what happened in the split second and one step after being shoved by Jrue to being at Tatum. And I say that after having been both the Martin and Tatum (and the Jrue,lol) in similar situations.
It isn’t anything personal, but if you don’t watch the clip and very easily blame this on the shove, it’s clear to those who have played dudes of these kinds of speeds and sizes that you may not have played like, at all. Maybe like, small slow high school ball where there’s one or two dudes in the entire division who can dunk. But clearly nothing that helps you understand the speed and strength of this level. I played higher level than 99% of players and I can’t even park my car in the same lot as NBA dudes. It’s super human.
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Aww man you've got me. I claim defeat to the "you ain't tall or strong enough if you don't agree with my assumptions and personal anecdotes" card. And I'd better log off Reddit in general since I'm not a 6 and a half foot tall buffed jock and therefore has no way to interpret the force of a contact ny my own eyes.
One last thing tho, Occam's razor doesn't always leave "coincidence" because coincidence isn't always the least complex scenario. My personal anecdote, which might or might not be superior than yours, indicates that a suspiciously short and frame-lacking clip with the creator's namestamp as a watermark is usually made to push agedas. Enjoy the metaphysical fight with your assertions and mine!
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24
Holy lord, I am SO sorry I bothered.
So am I allowed to act like a victim for expressing my opinion and real world experience? We’re both literally applying our perspective here. You were just the one who cried about people who cite actually playing the sport, so I tried to softly explain how that actually may be worth listening to.
But you instead get extremely offended and stick your head in the sand when you could instead be humbled and learn from other perspectives that you actually might not be an expert in fucking everything because you decided what your perspective was within .02 seconds of seeing something.
Everyone here already knows how to spot shitty altered video. You dismiss that this is altered at inconsequential times, and most importantly you dismiss that it is out there unedited and it makes no difference.
Go touch some hardwood and stop crying. I hope you’ll be okay.
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u/DeeboDongus Heat Apr 22 '24
Bro you can see it in the original angle wtf are you on about
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Nah I'm not gonna bother with a comment that has nothing to do with what I said or what my opinion is.
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u/Brady331 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Yeah its definitely altered a bit
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24
If it’s altered by a single frame right when impact happens then it’s also altered by a single frame as Bam shoots the ball. I don’t see you all saying shit about that
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u/Brady331 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Im not saying Jrue didn’t push him or anything, just that the vid felt a little off
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 22 '24
I get it. Just pointing out It also felt identically weird and off at an inconsequential part of the video
Neither little blip prevents anyone seeing clearly what happened. That’s all I’m saying
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Lol I've seen those tricks constantly used ny NBA fandoms to slander each other ever since the Kobe-TMac days. Get rid of some key frames here, alter the playback speed there, and cut it out right after it shows what I want it to show as a cherry on top. I feel damn rejuvenated by this thread, reminds me of the good ol' days of bashing each other.
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u/LgDietCoke Apr 22 '24
It’s just funny how nobody mentions what is clearly doctored footage. Maybe they don’t feel it impacted the end result, idk.
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u/soooogullible Jazz Apr 30 '24
Zero reason other than editing style. Just like in the Jrue video. Wasn’t doctored for some agenda.
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u/Hammii44 Lakers Apr 22 '24
i can’t lie, as an objective fan with no dog in this fight some of yall r delusional. It was all an accident. Caleb didn’t seize any opportunity to hurt Tatum. He didn’t intentionally try to hurt him. Accidents happen, get over it.
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
It's objectively funny to watch two relatively insufferable fanbase throwing shit at each other (my flair prompts me to say "most insufferable" but unfortunately Lakers and Warriors exist) and the best case scenario is where we get to pile on one group of them first and turn the guns the next day i.e. what's happening right now.
Personally I believe the main cause for the impact is that Martin was unnecessarily reckless and didn't care about where he might be going to. But whatever, fuck the Celtics and the Heat regardless of the truth.
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u/Atlos Celtics Apr 22 '24
So this definitely changes things, looks pretty accidental. But why is bro trying to offensive rebound like his life depends on it when they are down 20 with 55 seconds left lol. To be fair Joe should’ve subbed everyone out once we sustained their run.
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u/recollectionsmayvary Nets Apr 22 '24
But why is bro trying to offensive rebound like his life depends on it
Meh, I could just as easily question - why is Jrue pushing anyone up 20 with 55 seconds to go?
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u/Ajernaca Wizards Apr 22 '24
u/BearlyLogical thoughts on who's dirty? Is Jrue dirty here or is it just Martin still?
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u/gamefreak027 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Live / in other replay it didn't look like jrue altered him much but that's a pretty decent shove when you're already moving fast.
Still moving mostly laterally instead of vertically for the board, probably looking for a steal post Tatum landing, but it's undeniable that jrue altered his line there.
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u/LinwoodKent Apr 22 '24
He is pushed, collects himself, and hits Tatum. He isn't off balance. His momentum hasn't changed much. This video doesn't make the play not dirty. I'm not sure it was dirty anyway.
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Apr 22 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Cherrypicked cam angles can make LeBron look like the dirtiest mf who has ever picked up a ball. The shit I give about every controversial clip is directly proportional to the length, framerate, resolution and the lack of editing to the footage. This clip has a bad score in my book.
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u/ChiefSoldierFrog Apr 22 '24
It was so blown out of proportion. Tatum wasn't even upset.
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Regardless of the intention of anyone this says more about Tatum's personality
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u/KeDoG3 Heat Apr 22 '24
People calling it intentional and you see these replay angles and how the national broadcast shows Caleb trying to check on Tatum like 1 second after Tatum hits the floor.
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u/recollectionsmayvary Nets Apr 22 '24
He fouls Tatum on a play like 30 seconds later and makes sure to hold his mid section and keep him stable, whisper something to him and do a butt tap and JT does like “we’re good” head nod.
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u/cl353 Heat Apr 22 '24
Nah I saw Celtics fans saying that was also dirty and a sign of how composed Tatum was
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Another problem with the overhead angle is that it doesn't show vertical movements. One claim yesterday claims that Martin jumped when he knew he would be crashing into Tatum, and this angle cannot disprove it.
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u/Kzgoated Heat Apr 22 '24
I mean he did jump and turn to brace for impact that still doesn’t make it dirty tho. In fact the only player who made anything close to a dirty play was Jrue for shoving Martin once he realized he was to slow to box him out.
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u/HipnotiK1 Knicks Apr 22 '24
i think equally important as the shove is caleb was looking at the ball the whole time. the other angles you couldn't see his eyes and it made it seem like he ran almost right towards tatum. other angles made the shove seem far less impactful also.
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u/Proof-Research-6466 Heat Apr 22 '24
I tried to tell folks this yesterday but because of my flair I’m bias 😂
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u/el_be Bucks Apr 22 '24
First time I saw the replay I saw the push. Glad this is making its rounds now. I don’t like the the Heat or the Celtics for obvious reasons lol, but like, come on… To call that a dirty play is ridiculous. Dude is running full speed, tracking the ball (he’s looking directly at it the entire time), gets a significant shove as he’s about to take off for the rebound, and collides with another player who’s jumping. Sure it looks bad, but the shove is what set that in motion. And obviously Jrue wouldn’t know that his shove would’ve caused that to happen, he’s just given a dude a nudge to throw him off his line to a rebound. It was just wrong place wrong time for Tatum.
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u/hankbaumbach Bulls Apr 22 '24
Quick clip, but both replays (the original and this one) it appears like Martin is staring at the ball the entire time he's running up.
It's small, but goes a long way for me to think this wasn't intentional.
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u/GuestBadge Warriors Apr 22 '24
Caleb Martin is INNOCENT!! Lol Pretty wild people were calling for his head just yesterday, funny how internet works
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u/TuaTime_1 Apr 22 '24
I’m sure this post will get downvoted into oblivion since everyone here loves to hate on the Heat no matter what.
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u/vis-major Apr 22 '24
When Marcus Smart dives into the Steph's legs, it's heart and hustle but god forbid if the other team is physical they're automatically dirty. Fucking idiotic Scalabrine running his mouth about Spo yesterday, what does he have to say about it now? If you're going to make such big claims at least watch the full play from multiple angles to make sure you aren't revealing yourself to be the biggest idiot in the world.
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u/Brady331 Celtics Apr 22 '24
Smart didn’t dive into Steph’s legs and Martin didn’t purposely launch himself into Tatum.
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u/SkullBean Raptors Apr 22 '24
This was pretty obvious even in the other angle. No one speeds up in that short amount of time unless pushed.
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u/Ok-Discipline9998 Raptors Apr 22 '24
Getting pushed horizontally won't make you accelerate forward that's entry level dynamics
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